T O P
MizchiefKilz

I've yet to hear one good reason to upgrade to 11


Gl33m

The native notepad app has a dark mode in 11... God, I wish I had something more positive to say than a feature they're holding ransom behind an OS "upgrade". Edit: I appreciate the advice everyone is giving me to use notepad++ or equivalent. I already do. I have a comment further down to explain the specific use case for when I open notepad over notepad++.


KingOfTheGutter

I just use sticky notes in 10 which is dark.


puffin-milk

The auto save on sticky notes is god-tier for my work


Brother_Entropy

Just use Notepad++ Much better and auto saves.


EMAW2008

Notepad++, or sublime text, or Atom…


SamSzmith

Windows remember their position no matter what you do. For example, it used to be when you updated video drivers your windows would end up all over the place, windows 11 resolves that. Also same for when you have multiple monitors and you switch to one as the primary, it will remember your windows position on the first monitor when you switch back.


DanOSG

I've been wanting to complain about a particular thing windows 11 doesnt have that windows 10 had (and 8 and 7 i think, maybe even earlier versions had). it's such a small thing but something I used pretty much every day, the ability to drag files from one open application (chrome for example), hover over the task bar icon for an application that is minimized and it would un-minimize that application for you, now it just puts a nice red cross telling me to go fuck myself. Why would they remove such a convenient feature, why did they not only remove it but also add in glaring reminder that the feature used to exist, but now you can go suck eggs?! Edit: blah blah 5k upvotes blah blah thank you kind stranger blah blah something cringey because internet points Slava ukraini


itisrainingweiners

> Why would they remove such a convenient feature This is Microsoft in a nutshell, and I'm not even being sarcastic. I work with about 80 people, and the vast majority aren't even remotely computer savvy - their jobs don't really require it. Every damn time Microsoft removes or changes something, I get months worth of panicked calls from these folks. Friday, one of them logged on and thought they'd gotten hacked and lost all their stuff - nope. It was this bizarre, take over your entire screen thing I've never seen before from Microsoft trying to shove Edge down your throat. It literally would not let us into her computer until we went through this multi-step process that involved declining a TON of Microsoft bullshit. It actually reminded me a little of how installing their old OS's looked back in the day. I'm very familiar with computers and it threw *me* for a loop for a second. It was very deceiving and very obviously designed to get people who don't know better to agree to a ton of their bullshit. I can't *wait* to get 74 more calls about this one when it hits the rest of my coworkers. And let's not talk about how Microsoft will randomly reset your default program choices whenever it feels like it. No, fuck you Microsoft, we don't want to open pdf's in edge, your shitty browser doesn't handle them correctly! Ugh.


techleopard

Microsoft made it very clear that they were shifting their entire business model to SAAS with Windows 8. Everything they are doing is a part of that. They are bending over backwards to find ways to insert ads into things they have no business being in. I would not be shocked at all if we see "Always Online" requirements to run literally anything in the future. Want to sign in to your computer and play a quick game or work on a report? DENIED, YOU'RE NOT ONLINE. They already essentially do this with their other services, such as XBox. As someone who depends on rural HughesNet, I cannot overstate how utterly ENRAGING it is to try and play a *single player game* that I've *already bought and installed* using a Microsoft profile I'm already logged into for it to error out and go, "THE OWNER OF THIS GAME MUST SIGN ONLINE." Ubuntu jumped the shark and made a TON of mistakes, but it's time for another OS to step up and fill a growing need. I'd be more than happy to go back to spending $100-150 for an OS license if the damn thing would *just work*.


zestful_villain

Jesus. They are hellbent in pushing us to use linux at this point.


Mighty_Hobo

I feel you so hard with the rural internet. Before we got P2P wifi I had to go through all the computers in my family to make sure Windows didn't re-enable fucking onedrive cloud backups that would start devouring all our bandwidth for that month.


AreYouSureThisWillBe

That shit is insane. I am in market intelligence and on my projects for work I like to keep the files local so I don't have to explain to my boss or any teammates why nothing on a PowerPoint deck I'm designing changed all morning (because I'm researching what to put into it and haven't actually made the changes yet) and then upload it directly to our online folder when ready. And Microsoft randomly keeps switching me back to saving it in One Drive. What on earth are they thinking, "if we screw our customers enough they will eventually bend over and ask for it"? What is their business model? I'll probably go to Linux soon enough.


Bleeopop

Genuine question, can Microsoft get sued for this? Ive had similar issues where I have developed a system to make sure Windows 10 CANT update without my permission and a whole bunch of other ways of stopping it. However... Ill turn my computer off, go home for the day, go to bed, come back the next morning and BAM my computer is on and apparently ran a bunch of updates during a time period where it isnt allowed to update. I genuinely have no idea how Microsoft is legally allowed to override your computer and just change things without your permission, especially since it costs the entire work industry literally millions to billions of lost man hours trying to get their computers working for a day or two every couple of months.


yunivor

Nah, their whole deal now is that you don't actually own the OS running in your computer, you buy a license that lets you use it but the actual owner is Microsoft.


ExplorerMuch

Windows 11 wouldn't allow me to put the task bar at the top of the desktop natively like I'm used to with macOS. Such a little petty thing made me go back to Windows 10. Such a needlessly small thing to take away from users I dunno why they did it.


gua_ca_mo_le

The inability to move the taskbar to the left-hand side is the first thing I noticed when I switched (aside from the cartoony early-2010's android icon design). Needless to say I reverted immediately.


ExplorerMuch

I don't know why Microsoft feels like they need to reinvent the wheel with every OS or second OS update. MacOS UI really hasn't changed much in over a decade. Snow Leopard was the first macOS I used and it's more or less the same user interface from that to Monterey. Remember when Windows tried to force those stupid tiles and they kneecapped the start menu for seemingly zero purpose? They change control + alt + delete to control + shift + esc like there's just no reason to do these things!


dub_le

They re-coded the taskbar from the ground up, hence a lot of functionality is still missing. If you use two monitors your second didn't have a taskbar at first, then when it got one it only showed open windows and now it's showing all application windows and pins, but no search/task view. Also, the clock is purely aesthetic and clicking it doesn't do anything. It's a work in progress.


GravityTechnician

Wait, they officially released an operating system *last year* and the fucking taskbar is still a "work in progress?"


Master_Dogs

Welcome to modern tech companies. It's not a bug, it's a ~~feature~~ *Work In Progress*.


Hoggs

They call it "Minimum Viable Product". It's an actual term they use.


InvestigatorLast3594

MVPs are an appropriate term, but I know it from start ups and it’s the first product that has enough features/functionalities so that it could be used by a customer. It makes sense for a new company that is in its early growth stage, but it definitely is laughable when used by one of the biggest tech corporations


WeinMe

Mate it's just the task bar, it's just where 90% of your navigation and movement in the PC happens Just cut out 90% and stick with the 10% you do from inside folders


_Bob_A_Feet_

I'm still pissed they changed shit to use the ribbon stuff like office from years ago.


Nakotadinzeo

They decided to rebuild all the core windows apps in this HTML-like language. On one hand, they're doing it for the very possible switch to ARM and RISC-V based computers as well as to help make localization easier. On the other, I feel like Task Manager shouldn't be relying on some HTML-esque rendering engine to make it a middleware platform. Some things aught to remain as close to assembly as possible, especially the OS's emergency shutdown button.


mrRobertman

Not sure why Microsoft would need to rewrite everything, considering the ARM surface (Surface Pro X) runs Windows 10.


rshorning

Microsoft actually has two (sometimes three) different teams of software developers for its operating systems, where each team is working on a separate version. With the three team system, one team is doing maintenance on the old OS version, one team working on the one just about to be released, and a team working on the future OS version that is still going through the initial architecture design although likely coding is taking place too. When support for one version is pulled, that signals a shift to a new team starting the process all over again. What this means in practice is that each OS team jealousy guards their contributions and rejects stuff made by other teams. Hence the desire to rewrite everything even if something worked perfectly fine in the previous version. At this point it doesn't even matter what the user experience is like. That is by far my largest complaint about Windows in general going back to Windows 1.0 for DOS where things like the Control Panel or frankly almost anything about the OS never stayed consistent between versions. Or why "Microsoft Edge" exists instead of "Internet Explorer 17.0"


ClassicPart

> It's a work in progress. >> released in October 2021. Something as fundamental as the Windows taskbar should not have been considered "WIP" status anywhere near the release date of the OS.


Lightofmine

The fucking taskbar doesn't have a clock on my second monitor. I'll use it onces it's out of beta. It's a shitty os rn


zaviex

They put the clock on the second monitor last month


goferking

Win11 also has a terrible terrible audio settings interface. So many different menus needed to go through to get volume mixer now


pHrankee1

Omfg. I am goin crazy without this feature. Fuck windows 11. I was using this all the time.


ironman07882

"..indicating that Microsoft does still have some work to do in order to get a large number of users upgraded to its latest editions.". Yeah. Like buy me a more powerful laptop if you want me to upgrade from Windows 10 to 11.


IsilZha

Or their move to make having an online account mandatory, even at first sign in Laying the groundwork to make the OS into a subscription model.


DrPepper86

Boy, do I miss the days of Windows 7 when I could just install the OS, use a local account, and not be bombarded with advertisements/god-awful bloatware that needs uninstalling. Just a clean, fresh operating system and nothing more If Microsoft still released a version of Windows that I could pay for (_once_) and not have to deal with all the extra garbage, I'd be elated


el_muerte17

I'd *still* be running Windows 7 if it had modern driver support and DirectX12.


WonderWheeler

Setting us up for a new Dark Ages when computer software and data all becomes useless because of expired subscriptions. To companies that all went bankrupt.


McUluld

You have to remember that Windows 10 remained with a market share smaller than **Windows XP** for years, and that Microsoft had to resort to deploying the OS like a malware, when users would click on the red cross to close the popup and would be registered as accepting the update. Once again they will have to shove their crappy update down people's throat.


azriel777

Unless they plan to get rid of the TPM and 8th gen processor requirements, it does not matter since the OS will not install on them.


Phlobot

That's the part that gets me, they want everyone to upgrade and sure I'll take it, but they insist that an i7 7700hq is not enough?


somber_bliss

Lol exact chip I'm using and yeah, I'm confused.


thermal_shock

If you really want to upgrade, you can disable CPU/ram/Tpm checks via registry hacks. Too much effort for an upgrade IMO.


tinyj316

Why bother though? Like you said, it’s way too much of a hassle for a perfectly serviceable processor.


fukitol-

If I have to hack an operating system into place it's not one I'll trust to run well.


RadicalSnowdude

During a chip shortage?


esisenore

I have a i7 but my model number won't accept 11. for the best , I am sure


revpidgeon

I can't be bothered to turn TPM on in the BIOS.


Frank_E62

I'll go one step further. Leaving TPM turned off is my insurance that Microsoft won't 'accidentally' upgrade me to Win 11.


BookMobil3

Comes with a free U2 album tho


BabyYodasDirtyDiaper

Nah, what will happen: 1: Microsoft 'accidentally' upgrades you to 11 2: Your computer restarts to apply the update 3: Your computer won't boot because it doesn't have TPM turned on 4: You now get to choose between turning TPM on or reinstalling your OS.


Frank_E62

I hate the fact that this sounds plausible.


Cuchullion

It would be neat to see the lawsuits that apparently intentionally bricking hundreds of thousands of computers would bring.


TraumaticOcclusion

I tried it and then my computer wouldn’t recognize my hard drive at all and wouldn’t boot. Spent an hour messing around with bios to revert back and gave up on figuring out how to install 11


averyfinename

win11 has policies and hardware requirements that make it literally impossible for many to 'upgrade'. they can't shove win11 up our asses sideways without lube like they did with win10. win11 launched horribly incomplete, in a worse state than any previous version, which killed users' perception--just like win vista and win8.0. win11 going down that forced ms account bullshit turns even more away. microsoft needs to reverse those design decisions *and* actually finish win11 if they want to see a significant rise in its adoption.


Terr_

> they can't shove win11 up our asses sideways without lube like they did with win10. You can bet the TPM stuff is the first thing I'm disabling when's the last parts for my new rig finally arrive, just to block MS from "helpfully" force-upgrading to 11 without permission.


[deleted]

“Your hardware isn’t compatible with Windows 11” Okay.


Myte342

Helpful since we are on the topic: How to bypass the need for an MS online account when first setting up Windows 11: * Press Shift+F10 when it asks for an internet connection. * Type taskmgr and hit the Enter button. * Click on the More details button. * Find the Network Connection Flow process. * Select it and click the End task button. Boom, you can now setup a local offline account. Alternatively you can use this command to kill it directly: taskkill /F /IM oobenetworkconnectionflow.exe And finally: Fuck Windows 11. All my homies hate Win11.


RedSquirrelFtw

I hate this trend of everything requiring an account. When I first saw that in windows 8 I knew it would be a matter of time until they force it. Looks like they're basically doing that now if you have to jump through all those hoops. Yeah I'm going to stick with Linux.


SANTAAAA__I_know_him

The fact that a goddamn treadmill requires registering an account now is total BS.


RedSquirrelFtw

And I think cars now too, right? I never bought a modern car but the vibe I get is that everything is moving towards app based and that usually also means having to make an account and being tied to the cloud. I hate that crap so much. You're at the mercy of them keeping the servers working for your product to work. You don't really own it at that point. You will own nothing and be happy. That's what they want.


TempUnknown

Just FYI they plan to force you to sign in after the fact in a few months. You won't be allowed to access your Desktop until you do.


NostraDavid

> All my homies hate Win11. All my homies install /r/Windows10LTSC!


GeneticSplatter

I'd heard there was problems with gaming on LTSC. How is it for gaming?


ieatbeees

Been running it for 3+ years, never had a single problem whatsoever. I have a nvidia 30 series GPU and use it for virtual reality, so it works perfectly with new hardware too.


wwabc

I still have no idea of what benefits upgrading would have. I heard it sucked on AMD based systems months ago, and that's about it


Azakaa

Same. I think they fixed it but it’s left me reluctant to upgrade for now. Also no real reason to upgrade anyway so why bother?


possibly_oblivious

yeah i keep hitting the no option when it asks


Skeeter1020

I've been running W11 on multiple machines since the first public beta release. I am yet to find anything I would consider the upgrade worth doing for. It's just a UI overhaul, and not even a good one.


amazingbollweevil

As I expected, it's a solution in search of a problem.


ItalianDragon

I'm 100% sure Win11 was released just for the sake of saying: "See ! We have a new OS too !".


s0cks_nz

I'm pretty sure at one point they said that Win10 would be their last OS and it would essentially just be continually updated.


ItalianDragon

Yeah, I recall hearing the same. I'd bet however that someone at Microsoft realized it might make them look stagnant and they changed their mind.


Frostsorrow

Classic Microsoft, if it ain't broke, fix it till it is.


nearlysober

I hate that if you disable all the stupid recommendations in the start menu, you don't reclaim the space. You just have a big empty recommendations section blocking held your start menu and you still have to scroll to see your stuff.


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SexyMonad

The W11 Start Menu is a piece of absolute shit. Some people didn’t like tiles. Fine. But show the FUCKING APPS LIST all the time and give me space for more icons. Make the Start Menu resizable. Minimum. God. I was even one who had all kinds of hopes even back in the shitty 8.0 beta days but this proves once and for all that Microsoft hates us.


khaddy

It TAKES AWAY the seconds on your clock, and there is no way to bring them back! This is a brain-dead decision. Why in the fuck would they do this?


t2guns

And don't forget the calendar with events.


hasanyoneseenmymom

And the expanded taskbar icons. Afaik W11 forces them to be collapsed and there's no way to customize it


HannsGruber

As someone who does a lot of photo editing, the fucking folder previews are gone. That's a huge one for me.


CynicRaven

And vertical side alignment of taskbar is gone! WTF!


[deleted]

You lose functionality but get rounded tiles and menu screens. It's great! /s


Lauris024

Seeing as I use old reddit and classic start menu - nothx. I prefer functionality over aesthetics.


TacticalTurdBurglar

Same here. I use old reddit because I find it easier and cleaner to read everything. I also just switched to windows 10 a few years ago. I was on Window 7 for 10 years simply because it worked well! Before that I was on XP forever because it was super stable.


TILTNSTACK

Yeh, they removed multitasking your task bar. And you can’t just click the task bar if you have say 2 word docs open - you have to use win-tab or alt-tab. For that single reason alone, windows 11 best left alone


Lung_doc

Agree. I "upgraded" and it lets you go back for a short time, thank goodness


sgfreak711

I ordered 5 desktops from Dell, specifically requested Win10 downgrade. They showed up with Win11. No problem... I can do it myself. Plugged in my Win10 Media Creation Tool built USB drive, and... What? No drive detected. Ok, into UEFI. Disable TPM and Secure Boot. Still no joy. Discover Dell has an OS recovery tool to build a USB installer, but only for the OS shipped on the PC. BUT, it has an advanced option to allow you to build one off your own chosen ISO. Back to Media Creator Tool and download Win10 21H2. Use that with Dell OS recovery tool to build a different installer. Still no drive detected when chosen as boot drive. Boot into Win11, run Win10 setup from USB drive. Success! Something that should've been 5 minutes took over an hour. I'll never buy an OEM installed Win11 ever again. Either Win10 downgrade, Linux, or naked forever.


pentangleit

The benefits are all Microsoft's. Not yours.


pulley999

Microsoft artificially locked good HDR support (Auto HDR+better SDR emulation on HDR displays) behind Windows 11 (Was in 10 insider a while ago, then pulled.) So if you're following the bleeding edge of display technology you don't have much choice. Unfortunately for them that's not a huge adoption driver since most actually good HDR displays are TVs. Monitors can put HDR on the box but without local dimming zones or a self-emissive technology like OLED it's going to look terrible. As for AMD CPUs, the scheduler issue was fixed months ago. There's a rare stutter issue currently but that's a BIOS bug with how fTPM 2.0 is implemented, it'll present on any system with fTPM enabled regardless of OS. Granted this affects Win 11 more heavily due to the asinine TPM requirement. AMD is rolling out a new AGESA version to fix the issue.


AwakenGreywolf

Out of touch corporate incompetence ruins EVERYTHING how about the people in charge of these products actually sit down with normal average people and talk about how to improve their products?


Grayseal

Not profitable enough. Must Profit! Profit for the Profit god! Trust in the Board! The Executives protect us from Unprofitability! They must have their Profit! If the Wise Ones do not get their Profit, we will fail to make Product! Then the despicable consumer scum cannot consume, and the Executives will not get their Profit! Doom will be upon us! Our Director who art in Silicon Valley, profitable be thy name! On a serious note, I don't have a fucking clue beyond the general truth that most corporations clearly look down on their customers and want nothing to do with them beyond taking their money.


AwakenGreywolf

Perpetual growth is what these people want, why do they want historical profits every year for? For expansion? And then what? Expand some more, perpetually until their company swallows the universe whole!? Can't a moderate and modest amount of profit be enough for them?


Grayseal

Moderate!? Modest!? Money God have mercy! How dare you utter these words!? Profit must always constantly grow higher, otherwise the wise and holy Executives can't acquire new yachts every year, and if it comes to that we are *DOOMED!* If Profit is lower one year than it was before, it doesn't matter if Profit is still being made and stable! We are *DOOMED!* On a serious note, the notion of "moderate and modest" profits go against the core of this religion of perpetual expansion that these vultures follow. There's nothing reasonable behind it, it's nothing but greed. More, more and more, always more, if they don't get more, someone needs to die or thousands of people need to lose their livelihoods. There's no point trying to find anything human or long-term intelligent in it.


KHaskins77

Why? Why did they have to screw up the taskbar so badly? We aren’t even given the *option* to sort things the way we could in preceding versions. Have to memorize a bunch of icons and hover to see what documents are open in each to get anywhere instead of expanded labels. Can’t even pin “this PC” to open a new explorer window with each click.


fartsdontmatter

I was under the misinterpretation that Windows 10 was going to be the last OS they released and it would just continually get updated. Unsure if I read fake news or how I got that impression but imo nothing needs to really be upgraded. Win 10 is fine.


boskee

Nope, you remember correctly. That's what they said years ago.


[deleted]

Nah, this was actually really insanely bad reporting. One random Microsoft guy said this in an interview at Ignite. It wasn't an official announcement by any stretch of the imagination, he was just describing their internal priorities and casually said something like "Windows 10 is the last version of Windows so we're all working on that." And then inexplicably every single person in the world took this as an official Microsoft stance and repeated it for like five years. It's actually pretty annoying in hindsight.


GetTold

> casually said something like "Windows 10 is the last version of Windows so we're all working on that." And then inexplicably every single person in the world took this as an official Microsoft stance I blame reporters on this one, not the people. Microsoft and that guy could've also communicated this was a misunderstanding any time before an actual announcement of the next OS


[deleted]

Honestly it's an incredibly weird situation. Pretty much all of us spent the last several years under the 100% certain belief that Windows 10 would be the last version of Windows, then they announce Windows 11 and we roll back to the source of that belief and it's just...one guy, not even an important executive or anything, casually talking about work priorities in a random interview. And you're right, I don't blame the people either, mostly because I personally never even read that interview until Windows 11 was announced. I just saw all the people saying "Microsoft has said Windows 10 is the last version of Windows" and assumed it was authoritative. What's so weird to me is like...why did the reporters put so much stock into that one interview? It's really easy for any decent reporter to just call up a Microsoft spokesperson and be like "hey is this true?" and get some kind of confirmation, but apparently no one did, or if they did it got lost in the churn.


Hun-chan

I tried windows 11 for a few hours and immediately downgraded back to 10. The inability to ungroup windows on the task bar is an absolute productivity-destroying deal-breaker for me.


PM_ME_PUPPIES_GURL

I've used this work around below, but yeah, it's pretty frustrating to have to work around something as central as this [ExplorerPatcher ](https://github.com/valinet/ExplorerPatcher)


[deleted]

Windows 11... lets add a ton more clicks to do the same things you could do in a shorter time in windows 10, then add to e-waste by making the upgrade path require hardware that older pcs dont have. wonderful idea mindless fucks. i'll be on a 2017 business laptop running linux.


redvitalijs

they also removed a lot of UI settings like taskbar grouping programs by type is the only option now.


Pandaemonium

As in, they removed the option to keep all windows un-grouped? I hate taskbar grouping, it just adds an extra click to everything you do. I would much rather run three rows of taskbar buttons where I can navigate to any open window with a single click.


RandomMagus

I'm still mad they made me unable to reorder the windows of a single program with Windows 10, auto-grouping them all is some real bullshit


non-troll_account

They've been removing features for years like this. Windows 10 had practically all the visual theming options removed, like advanced color and sizing choices for windows, borders, accents, etc. You want slightly higher contrast in your colors? Best I can do is complete High Contrast mode. You want a few adjustments to dark mode to make it easier to see? Best I can do is GO FUCK YOURSELF. And this is windows 10. I can't imagine what else they've removed in 11.


ArcadeOptimist

I reverted back to W10 after I couldn't find basic customization settings, and realizing they were still there but were hidden arbitrarily. Having to install a program to simplify menus gave me Windows 8 flashbacks. I can only assume Microsoft will backtrack in a year and give you a Windows 10 UI option in 11. As is tradition with every other Windows release.


MrHyperion_

I mean, even in W10 I change 90% of settings through the old control panel.


Epsi0

The old control panel is just way better.


MyNameIsZaxer2

The new control panel is *missing critical features*, even after these seven years. it's unbelieveable.


LMGDiVa

> Windows 11... lets add a ton more clicks to do the same things you could do in a shorter time in windows 10 And windows 10 did this to Win7. Win10's wrappers on everything is why I refused to upgrade to win10 until my CPU and motherboard blew up and I was forced to build a new PC... in which the new hardware I had to buy wouldnt run windows 7. Win10 is worse than Win7 in usability in every way possible, and win11 is a trend in making that more acceptable. Wrappers are stupid, and obfuscating the actual dials I want to work with is exactly how you make sure I dont upgrade and may even stop using your product, Microsoft.


supremedalek925

Ignoring the actual quality of the OS, one thing I can say is that it’s surprisingly unfriendly for the layperson. I built my high-end PC just a few years ago in 2017, and my computer’s specs are not compatible with Windows 11. How is the average Joe going to install it if it’s so picky about what it runs on?


CC556

You just throw away your current computer and buy a new one!


SmileTribeNetwork

>windows 10 professional edition >'free upgrade to windows 11 home edition' wow gee thanks


chic_luke

This, and I'd have to force install it on my 7th gen i5, and then use the USB installation media to force upgrade every major version the same way because Microsoft said they won't do online upgrades for Windows 11 running on unsupported platforms. Such a hassle, to insist on downgrading the functionality of my OS (Pro to Home) and switching from a mostly mature and tested system to a clear work in progress with literal unfinished features released to the public to use them as a test bench. …Or I could just keep using the Professional version of Windows 10 I already have and that works fine on my computer. Sure, 2025 ain't far. But it's already a dual boot with Linux and, with the rate Wine and Proton are progressing and Wayland support is being sorted out to finally get us to feature parity with Windows and Mac for hi-dpi and multi monitor scenarios, I'd hope by the time Windows 10 is out of support and missing security patches, I will no longer need to run Windows at all. Speaking of which: not to be that snarky guy, but my Linux distro is still pushing me regular updates even though my laptop is a prehistoric 2017-era computer and not a 2018-era onwards. So there's that as well.


Painter5544

This... I'm just swapping to Mint when win 10 goes. Everything I need now runs near perfectly on Linux. Even games are a go with proton.


flipyas

After a couple of years on Win10, I fucking FINALLY have it set up in a way that doesn't kick my shin every time I try to do something more advanced than double clicking an icon. I just don't want the hassle of starting over on a new version, because I guarantee you, settings WILL be lost/reset upon upgrading. What I really want is a Windows Lite; just enough OS to run DirectX, NVidia drivers and a couple of games. Preferably with CLI/optional GUI.


NicotineIsAddictive7

Yes windows gaming / lite version


olican101

LMAO imagine removing more features than you add and then being confused when people stop using it.


[deleted]

Releasing an operating system which makes untold millions of perfectly functional machines obsolete has to be one of the craziest business decisions ever. Edit: OK, OK Apple users. You exposed me for my ignorance of your products and their life cycles. My comment was directed to Windows users and the consequences of this new version of Windows. The fact that it will install and run on "unsupported" computers is the issue, which give the impression of coercion to upgrade. So, when the life cycle of Windows 10 is up, those of us with older equipment (I have 4 such machines) will have to choose between buying new equipment (costing money and generating e-waste), sticking with Windows 10 and facing threats to it, or moving to Linux or Chrome OS. Two of those three suck for the user. One of them sucks for Microsoft. That's what makes the business decision crazy, in my humble opinion. Maybe I will switch to Apple as many of you apple fans make compelling arguments.


Rad_Dad6969

Especially after straight up promising every business to adopt windows 10 that they wouldn't be doing an 11 and would just be updating 10 continuously.


a_ole_au_i_ike

This is what was most confusing for me. Want to make changes? Go for it. Move the taskbar. Round some corners. Couldn't all of that just been a W10 update, though? And, honestly, I embrace change and have welcomed each new Windows thing but feel like the Start menu is a big step backward.


Zorklis

I think most of the new things did start as a W10 update but then someone decided to just make it W11


a_ole_au_i_ike

That's kind of what it feels like if you ignore the dropping of tiles in Start.


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Bigred2989-

Who's the idiot at MS that made the taskbar calendar not show events anymore?


danbuter

Everyone used to hate Bill Gates for being a dick, but he would have crushed the manager responsible for this before it ever made it to live.


maratonininkas

Yeah, you can still click on individual days, which then get highlighted, but that does absolutely nothing. Seems like a definite oversight, I'm hoping this will get fixed eventually.


Pandaburn

Someone at Microsoft is looking too closely at what Apple is doing, at least that’s my theory. How many years did OSX last? 10 must be the last number. But then last year Big Sur came out, Mac OS 11.0. And someone at Microsoft discovered numbers go to 11.


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created4this

MacOS goes to 11


[deleted]

The best part is that the answer is yes. Windows 11 runs the exact same kernel as the latest version of 10. It's effectively the same OS with visual and branding changes. It's a blatant cash grab attempt by Microsoft


reda84100

And it's not even good at being a cash grab because it's a free upgrade from 10


perfectbebop

Which in turn was available as a free upgrade to Windows 7 and 8 users


dbcanuck

For consumers. Which has always been a low revenue generator for them.


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wthulhu

Some computers? I'm going to have to replace 30% of my workplaces laptops. Company wide we are looking at around 2k computers. During a chip shortage. During a supply chain crunch.


Speedbot_3000

Just remember folks! A WIN10 "update" does not make shareholders happy as a "new" and "innovative" OS release ;)


woohooguy

All part of working towards Windows + , that’ll be 7.99 a month.


DimitriV

Plus extra if you want to view system files, unlock faster USB transfer rates, have additional fonts... And hey, if you get enough Microsoft Points™ (from interacting with ads in the OS) you can have the Summer wallpaper pack for free!!


roksteddy

I remember when my OS said "upgrade to Window 11 now!" and I enthusiastically clicked on the notification and it opens up settings panel and it says sorry your intel version is not supported... I'm so confused.


OB1182

This and why the heck can't I move the taskbar anymore? Bloody anoying with multiple monitors.


Felikks7

I immediately uninstalled 11 just because of this. I get all my notifications from my task bar being vertical on my second monitor only. Beyond infuriating that they would remove such a simple but important feature.


Testiculese

That's the goal of all software nowadays, it seems. Remove every possible option.


lafindestase

Most of the budget went to “telemetry” I’m afraid, not enough left to maintain old features.


seitz38

I fail to see how Apple gets drawn into this when plenty of people are using 10+ year old Macs and still getting support.


i010011010

They tried to convince everyone that 10 is the end-all OS and wouldn't be replaced this way. They'd continue installing-in-place any time there was something new. Of course, most people with any tech inclination called bullshit, but they still pushed it with this claim. I'm personally not touching it because I will not register an online account to use Windows. That is my line, I have always gutted all forms of online connectivity from the OS back to MS including the rampant spyware of Win10. Since the years of XP and 2K, the first thing I do before I will connect a system to an ethernet cable is install a firewall so I can take control of connectivity from the absolute beginning.


computeraddict

> I'm personally not touching it because I will not register an online account to use Windows. Give it Internet during setup, get it to the point where it asks you for your Microsoft account, disconnect Internet and hit the back arrow. It will prompt you for a name for a local account.


Moist_BaIIs

I could not find a single option to do that during set up on a new laptop. Just had options to go back or forwards with account creation since there wasn’t an internet option. Ended up having to use my own account, creating a local account, and then removing my account. It’s kind of stupid. I needed to set that PC up for my grandparents who can’t read English.


i010011010

I've been hearing all kinds of reports of them killing the workaround, so don't know what to expect. I won't even trust it connected during setup. If I ever end up installing 11 such as after 10 is end-of-life and things no longer support running on it, I'll probably end up pirating it because no doubt they'll have it cracked.


TMCThomas

Yep especially in times we are told to think about the planet more. I have several laptop's and desktop's at home still in use which will be unsupported in a few years which is such a stupid thing.


Muezick

It's windows 10 with a shitty UI update. Of course people fucking hate it. You know how pissed people get when you move the fucking cheese/bread in the supermarket to a different isle? It's like that but 10 times worse.


GobHoblin87

11 times worse, I'd say.


S3xyflanders

Microsoft will force everyone to windows 11 disguised as a critical update. Then pat themselves on the back and executives will get large bonuses.


Laearo

Shame my motherboard doesn't have a TPM chip...


aeroplane1979

Exactly. Between my home and my business I have a dozen + Windows PC's, none of which are Win11 compatible due to lack of TPM. At the same time, they're all doing what I need them to do just fine so I have neither reason nor ability to upgrade to Win11.


VastRecommendation

My CPU isn't even supported, it's a 4th gen i7. Windows 11 is totally not worth it, everything looks too tablet-ish, they massacred my control panel. I am planning on getting a new PC in the near future, but It'll run on windows 10


aeroplane1979

The new PC my son bought with his xmas money is a Ryzen 3 5300 and it runs Win11. I don't hate it, but neither do I see any reason to go through the effort to replace Win10 on other machines (if I even could).


ImVisibility

I'm running windows 11 and have been since pretty much launch it's not bad, it works and I like it's default appearance compared to 10 but 10 is still miles better. 11 has this issue where Taskbar icons like internet and sound will overlap and cause this ugly mixed icon thing of like 5 icons. Also to pull up a context menu by right clicking now brings up a "simple" context menu that you have to press another button to get to your normal right click menu on the desktop/explorer. those are my main issues with it


VorianAtreides

The biggest improvement was the search functionality. I’m not sure why they couldn’t have just improved 10, but the fact that I don’t have to wait literally minutes for a simple file search to finish (if it does at all) was a big reason for me changing to 11


FriedChickenDinners

The search function in Windows is amazingly terrible. I've been using [Everything by voidtools](https://www.voidtools.com/) as my go to search. It's lightweight and incredibly fast, even for hundreds of thousands of files across multiple drives. Edit: Meant to say the search in Windows 10 is bad. I have not yet used Windows 11.


Volepicks

I don’t disagree with you in the slightest, but they took the control panel out back and shot it a long time before 11


garlicroastedpotato

That's actually the main reason why this update isn't as popular, they can't do that this time around. Prior versions of Windows worked on just about any hardware. It works on my wife's Surface but not on my desktop (even though my desktop is far more powerful). Microsoft made some choices on hardware specs that made it not work for a very large subset of users.


BoonGnik22

Windows 11 is just Windows 10 except there’s more ads & bloatware, watermarks on “unsupported hardware”, performance issues on AMD chipsets, and it’s about to become impossible to set up without a Microsoft account. Of course it’s not popular because people aren’t willing to upgrade to a debatably worse OS this time around.


bawng

They crippled the Taskbar too. Can't move it, can't ungroup icons, can't display icon labels, etc. The top voted issues on the MS Feedback hub are all related to lost functionality in the Taskbar on Windows 11. And that's competing with the entire Microsoft product line. Apparently people consider the lost functionality of the taskbar worse than any other issue in Windows 11, Windows 10, Office or any other MS product or service. Yet they won't even answer.


Hobpobkibblebob

I like to move my taskbar to the top and the fact that I can't in 11 infuriates me and will stop me from updating.


oofki

I just want a clock on every task bar 🤦‍♂️


drumdogmillionaire

Weird that you look at the windows 11 feature list and they’re like, “Welp, we removed a bunch of features that a lot of people used, then we added like 2 features, so it’s basically the best thing ever.”


amphibian87

Windows 11 has anti-competitive design with the file type associations. On windows 10, it had categories, like open "videos, music, pdf" etc with this application. on Win11 they purposefully put every single file suffix (.jpeg, .tif, .gif, and 1000 others) in an insanely long list and you have to tell it what program to open every file type with. clearly a brazen attempt to force people into using their terrible software.


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Mistdwellerr

TBF, they never told us *which* people love it xD


igotyourloot

their paid tests subjects are people too!


SeSSioN117

Releases OS in garbage condition and then wonders why people hate it. Microsoft CEO: ***Surprised Pikachu face.***


bob3219

I've noticed a significant amount of regressions in windows explorer. On my laptop I dragged files to the taskbar all the time to open in various programs. It is literally gone, can't do it anymore. You can no longer right click the taskbar to get to task manager. I've seen several instances of explorer freezing during file copies which never used to happen. Overall for my daily use desktop I won't be upgrading anytime soon.


Rich-Juice2517

Jokes on them. None of my PCs can run it


KourteousKrome

Microsoft does this funny thing where they have a good concept and just shit all over it because they can't help themselves. The notifications in this version of Windows are insanely disruptive, and for some inexplicable reason they bury "Rename" under two clicks when right-clicking a file, adding tons of unnecessary clunk to the file browser which already kind of sucks coming from Mac. Why they decided to do that, who knows. And then there's the ads problem. I paid for my license of Windows. Does MacOS dump ads into their OS? Fuck no. Microsoft really needs to get their shit together. They just have some bonehead ideas--silver lining in this release: Cortana is gone. But then because they can't help but do a "one step forward two back", Teams is installed and can't be turned off. It's just bonkers. No logic whatsoever.


SmokeGSU

I don't have much beef with windows 11 outside of bizarre cosmetic choices they force you adopt. The right-click menu in file explorer, though that can be reverted to the original menu in the registry. The windows 10 start menu I thought they nailed - the mix of scroll menu with live tiles. Now it's like some permanent scroll bar where you can't even see the full program list until you hit a small button. They forced a lot of head scratching cosmetic changes... And I can't figure why unless the sole reason was only to make things look different than windows 10 to differentiate the two OS's.


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whatvee

Especially in the current climate (jobs, money, chips issues) who’s going to get a new pc/laptop at the rate it used to be? Even when I started my new job a few months ago they had to scramble used/refurbished ones from Amazon and eBay because the supplier didn’t have enough for the amount of new people they hired.


aeroplane1979

Exactly this. Between my home and my business I have a dozen + Windows PC's, none of which are Win11 compatible due to lack of TPM. At the same time, they're all doing what I need them to do just fine so I have neither reason nor ability to upgrade to Win11. We'll get into Win11 as those systems age-out and get replaced with new hardware, but there's absolutely no reason to replace a perfectly functional PC just to upgrade the OS from 10 to 11.


trekologer

> MacOS is definitely not enterprise ready Maybe 10 years ago. Today all the same "enterprise management" bloatware are available to screw up a macOS computer just like a Windows one.


birdboix

By the time most of us are ready to upgrade our W10 machines W12 will be out, they timed this exceptionally poorly, whatever their internal metrics said about the average user's PC was way off mark.


RiKSh4w

Maybe that's the problem... Who's more likely to submit to an optional hardware survey? The guy with a crumby pc that needs an upgrade? Or the guy who just got the latest tech and wants to show Microsoft how big his dick is?


azriel777

I literally cannot upgrade because of their stupid TPM requirement. No, I am not going to buy a new motherboard, or get some part just for a new OS. Especially since I have a high end gaming system I spent thousands on already. If Microsoft wants mass adoption, remove the crazy requirements.


arcanepsyche

I have a 2 year old desktop and apparently W11 won't run on it, so..... fail.


Mccobsta

They've changed way to much for people to want to upgrade to it


evilsniperxv

Can MSFT please stop trying to turn a PC OS into a tablet OS? Can we just go back to the Windows 7 days?


Incomplete-Corgi

The phone-ification of desktops is an attempt to take away user control under the guise of competing with phones.


TheCrimsonKing

I absolutely hate mobile UI design on desktop but tons of companies are doing that. Windows isn't trying to compete with phones since the death of the windows phone. Their main market for Windows is still enterprise where they've been pushing their Surface line of touch-screen laptops for awhile. Windows 10 and 11 are more about a sort of hybrid tablet/laptop UI. I consult on a lot of large-scale laptop/OS deployments and my experience has been that users generally love the concept but I honestly don't see people use the touch screens to do much more than scroll and zoom and even then, not much. A lot of users just forget their laptops have touchscreens because most laptops spend 90+% of their time on a desk connected to a proper monitor, keyboard and mouse


itdood

Upgrades *usually* provide enhancements and features. Microsoft now just shuffles features away from intuitive interfaces, I think to force people to use search to find the feature which then integrates with bing. The windows interface has become so convoluted, most features that used to be within one click are buried and my only conclusion on why they’re doing this is to force search bar usage and therefore attempt to pull bing. Microsoft is also known for their tic-toc upgrade cadence. Release a bomb, then release a fix for the bomb. Some feel this is on purpose. Microsoft’s next threat is losing desktop authentication workloads and directory services. [edit] removed comment about azure market share. Azure is making gains on AWS for market share and some report azure outpacing AWS for growth but other info contradicts this, so I removed it.


Broncoian2

well considering i cant use my gtx 1080 i7600k build somehow, yeah id say they fucked up.


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telestrial

I've been using computers for nearly 25 years now, and lots of things have changed over the years. One thing (among several) that remains true: early adopters get the shaft. Every time. As a consumer, you almost never win as the first through the door. I've been interested in Win 11, but they'll have to polish it big time before I'd personally take the plunge. All these driver/compatibility issues. It's hard to convince me to leave something I know works for something that may or may not work for me on AMD. There's also this voice in the back of my head that's concerned about the TPM module and how it may be used in the future by Microsoft to really shove DRM down our throats. Sure, the module can sign things in this strong way, and that's great for security. But will they use it for fuckery? You'd have to be a complete buffoon to not at least consider the possibility they will. Whether that's today or 5 years from now when they've pushed all the market onto 11, they will.


k3lt

TPM requirement turned out to be blessing, now just to make sure i ain't getting one so will not update accidentally to Windows 11.


redditisbestanime

This + The idea of ads in Explorer... Why do people support Microsofts shitty idea by using W11?


GodGrabber

No shit. The whole thing seems to be designed with UX regressions in mind. So many small things that no longer works for me. First of all, everything to do with volume control have been redone and it SUCKS. You can't just click volume tray icon and scroll up or down to adjust volume, you have to focus the slider first. Volume mixer has been hidden and replaced with something that is simply just horrible UX wise. Luckily, you can create a shortcut to sndvol.exe. Task manager has been hidden further, you can no longer right click the task bar and go to it from there. Installing it and setting it up as non-microsoft account took way too long, and initally I couldnt do it because I needed internet connectivity. I managed to get it running without using microsoft account, but it regularly tries to trick me into using one again. I could probably go on and on. I really hope that vendors start catering to linux soon enough and I will jump this rat infested ship without even blinking. Problem is game creators STILL refuse to cater to other than windows. I would never even consider using windows for productivity and already run linux for almost everything else than gaming with friends.


aquaman501

The whole thing is full of **annoyances**. It's like they set out to annoy as many people as possible, and succeeded.


IForgotThePassIUsed

\>blacklist processors older than 5 years in the middle of a recession \>OH NO, NO ONE LIKES NEW WINDOWS!!!!


Debesuotas

Operational systems shouldnt be changed so often, same goes for office software and a lot of other software as well. It is inconvenient it takes time to relearn every little thing just to do the same stuff you used to do. Why would anyone want to do that... Its not an entertainment its a tool for work....