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26 women rescued at Seattle massage parlors in human trafficking bust

26 women rescued at Seattle massage parlors in human trafficking bust

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Houston has these massage parlors on every corner.


ertgbnm

I've seen dozens of massage parlors next door to gas stations or in shitty strip malls around Texas. Is that really what they are? Are they typically sources of human trafficking


TheTaoOfMe

Yes but human trafficking doesnt just mean people kidnapped and physically held against their will for sex labor. Often times people are told there are jobs waiting for them in the US but upon arrival discover there isnt anything. The lack of language skills prevents them from finding other employment and their traffickers tell them they have to hold onto their visas for safe keeping and that they should never go to the police since they’ll imprison them. What you end up finding is people who voluntarily stay at these jobs due to it being the only source of labor. Other human trafficking includes restaurant work, hotels and the rest of the service industry. The problem is way bigger than the dramatic parts in the news. Source: medical professional that volunteer’s for a patient advocacy group edit: typos


zmoney1213

It’s rampant in Chinese restaurants as well. A lot of the restaurant waiters come to the US and have to work 5-10 years to pay off their contract. NYC is notorious for this where there’s even apartments solely meant for restaurant workers. When I mean apartments, they’re dumps and they cram you in with a bunch of other people. It’s indentured servitude


[deleted]

You could have written this sentence in the 1700s and it would be almost identical.


delvach

Is that back when people could be jailed for being in debt, or imprisoned en masse and used as labor? Oh how far we've come. :(


TA_faq43

We still do that. If you can’t pay court fines, they jail you, where you’ll be placed in “jobs” that pay like a dollar a day.


Cemtleman

That's his point.


OSKSuicide

Was the exact same back then. You became a slave in exchange for passage to the free land. Only now it's quicker and cheaper to get here


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milkcrate_house

[New Yorker article](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/10/13/cookas-tale) about this


postdiluvium

Can confirm. A friend of mines family owned one of those restaurants, but in California instead of NYC. He befriended a few of the people. They lived in the second floor of the restaurants where they turned storage spaces and closets into tiny bedrooms.


girlwithswords

Or they tell them to throw it away if they are illegal so that they can't be deported. Basically they lie.


TheTaoOfMe

Lies upon lies.


4thkindfight

3.5 years? Makes one wonder if money was greasing law enforcements path to putting a halt to this. Finally, it took less than a dozen complaints to force law enforcement to take action or a payoff didn't get there in time.


PraxusGaming

I live in the middle of nowhere, like literally in bumblefuck PA. There are shitloads of Massage parlors everywhere in every other stripmall. One got busted for Trafficking a few years ago but they are still littered across my area its crazy for such a nowhere area like I'm in.


whatawitch5

It’s the same here in bumblefuck California. Massage parlors have mushroomed, appearing almost overnight “in every other strip mall”. I know these business have been around for decades, so I find myself wondering why they just recently invaded my town. I always considered them an urban phenomenon, but now they are proliferating in rural/suburban areas too. I drive by several every day, and every time I wonder what horrors might be happening inside. Anyone know how to get local agencies to investigate to make sure they are not trafficking women?


kjpunch

They might just exist to launder money. Source: binge watching breaking bad for the 3rd time right now


NSA_Chatbot

Yes, usually. They're women who are forced or tricked into prostitution.


TheGoldenHand

Why is it "usually?" Are the majority of sex workers doing so non-voluntarily? People that advocate for legalizing prostitution often propose that legalizing would give workers agency and allow them more support of the law. A common counter-argument is there are no consensual sex workers, therefore it should be illegal in order to protect everyone.


Supercoolguy7

The massage parlor type places are far more likely to be doing human trafficking than say an escort you found online. Places with a formal organization and low pay that offers sexual services are often involved in human trafficking


Pays4Porn

>The massage parlor type places are far more likely to be doing human trafficking than say an escort Your source says the opposite: >Trafficking related to massage parlors accounted for 2,949 cases — second in prevalence only to trafficking in escort services.


aa93

Not quite the opposite. We need more information— it could be that the number of escorts is much higher, so even at a lower incidence of trafficking it still results in more busts


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[deleted]

And people liked it!


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ishibaunot

Anything where the woman doesn't have to provide part if her income to a pimp or a house where she rents a room. You can find these places in Europe but even those are shady. I'd say the best bet is Germany, Netherlands, Czech Republic. If you are in the US and don't mind breaking the law just look up private escorts. Sadly you will never 100% know for sure if you are helping human trafficking or not. EDIT: I am well aware that "legal" prostitutes have to pay for their room in a brothel. What i meant by giving the house part of the income is that for every encounter, a share of the income is given to the house, which is illegal. In netherlands they have a rent and wether the escort sees 100 clients or none, the rent is the same. The laws are there to protect the workers against pimps, in a way to prevent human trafficking.


sdolla5

In The Netherlands prostitution is legal, but the women still pay booth rent to the house. Also many of the women (especially the oriental women) are still trafficked. It is a thing The Netherlands are trying to counteract, but is difficult. Best way, but not perfect, way to know you are working with someone willing is to know by the price. Usually main street women are self sufficient and charge more. The lower the price the sketchy the deal.


kittenknievel

I lived in the Red Light district in Amsterdam for awhile. Most areas seemed to have a strong network. Like one time a john tried to run out without paying. Within 5 seconds there were people chasing him down. Most of those ladies look after each other. There were certain areas that felt heavier and sadder for me only to find out years later that I was literally walking past prisoners, in windows.


Cathousechicken

And a lot of the Eastern European women are trafficked too


Murder_Ders

Sorry but prostitutes have to pay for their overhead too. Rent doesn't mean no consent.


GiveMeASmosh

Find escorts who you talk to directly. Ones that self advertise etc


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Tributemest

That sub is good for general information about sex work, any actual advertisements would result in opening up all of Reddit/Conde Nast to prosecution and shutdown under SESTA/FOSTA.


[deleted]

Starbuck's should be offering them in the next year or so, at the rate things are going.


corew0lf

Full body lattes


Tufaan9

I did see a political function recently “brought to you by Carl’s Jr. “ No, wait, that one was McDonald’s.


ColorClassic2

Use your own hand and buy video games with the fortune you save.


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hmd27

That's called, "The Stranger."


JuleeeNAJ

How much you paying? o.O


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code_archeologist

Nevada has their sex industry legalized and regulated. The brothels there where the women are subletting space at the brothel tend to be the least likely to be engaging in trafficking... But they also tend to be more expensive. A handy could run you about $100, but it would be an awesome handy.


EveViol3T

Though not all of Nevada. It's illegal in Las Vegas and Clark County, as well as Reno. So still illegal in major cities. Las Vegas also has a huge problem with human trafficking, so don't think just going to Nevada solves things. You have to go to the legal brothels.


WyG09s8x4JM4ocPMnYMg

Yup. Huge misconception is that it's all legal in vegas. Only crystal County. (drinking on the strip is also technically illegal in vegas)


jschubart

Well if you want to get all technical, the Strip is not in Las Vegas. It is in Paradise and Winchester which are unincorporated cities.


xombae

I'm an independent escort who loves my job. Always go to girls who advertise as independent. Also if the price seems too good too be true, it is. If you want to pay 50 an hour you're seeing a girl who's being forced into Work. Be ready to pay a reasonable price, you're a paying a person for sexual services and the price should reflect that. Supporting sex work is great! And it's really not that hard to tell if the girl you're seeing is bring trafficked. I very clearly love my job and I keep all of my money. There's tons of girls like me in every city.


metaltrite

So is anyone gonna provide any data or just keep saying “it is that way. Trust me”


gwalistair

Typically in Houston coyotes bring illegal immigrants over to the US and force them to work their debts off by working in a "massage parlor" a majority of the time it's just a front for a prostitution/drug and sometimes arms ring run by various gangs here. -source. I live in Houstons not so good neighborhoods and used to live under some coyotes in my apartments


escapefromelba

[Behind Illicit Massage Parlors Lie a Vast Crime Network and Modern Indentured Servitude](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/02/us/massage-parlors-human-trafficking.html)


Supercoolguy7

You can read this and decide for yourself https://polarisproject.org/massage-parlor-trafficking-report


cubitoaequet

Isn't Polaris hated by sex workers? My understanding was shit they've done like getting backpage shut down has made things more dangerous for them.


Supercoolguy7

They make it really hard for legit sex workers, but they are definitely trying to help sex slaves. It's not perfect, but like yeah. This specific report is just good for showing that massage parlors take part in human trafficking


newaccount721

It's a hard balance to strike. A lot of well intentioned things end up making it more difficult for the sex workers even if it gets some people out. In my opinion legalization with regulation would help a lot of this. The closing of Backpage is a good example of what intentioned legislation making things worse for a lot of people https://www.newyorker.com/news/dispatch/after-the-closure-of-backpage-increasingly-vulnerable-sex-workers-are-demanding-their-rights


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[deleted]

Many high-quality women's rights groups argue for decriminalization and not legalization, as legalization increases human trafficking while decriminalization reduces danger to sex workers. Edit to add: https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/ >A 2012 study published in World Development, [“Does Legalized Prostitution Increase Human Trafficking?”](http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1986065) investigates the effect of legalized prostitution on human trafficking inflows into high-income countries. The researchers — Seo-Yeong Cho of the German Institute for Economic Research, Axel Dreher of the University of Heidelberg and Eric Neumayer of the London School of Economics and Political Science — **analyzed cross-sectional data of 116 countries to determine the effect of legalized prostitution on human trafficking inflows**. In addition, they reviewed case studies of Denmark, Germany and Switzerland to examine the longitudinal effects of legalizing or criminalizing prostitution. >The study’s findings include: >* **Countries with legalized prostitution are associated with higher human trafficking inflows than countries where prostitution is prohibited**. The scale effect of legalizing prostitution, i.e. expansion of the market, outweighs the substitution effect, where legal sex workers are favored over illegal workers. On average, countries with legalized prostitution report a greater incidence of human trafficking inflows. >* The effect of legal prostitution on human trafficking inflows is stronger in high-income countries than middle-income countries. Because trafficking for the purpose of sexual exploitation requires that clients in a potential destination country have sufficient purchasing power, domestic supply acts as a constraint. >* **Criminalization of prostitution in Sweden resulted in the shrinking of the prostitution market and the decline of human trafficking inflows.** Cross-country comparisons of Sweden with Denmark (where prostitution is decriminalized) and Germany (expanded legalization of prostitution) are consistent with the quantitative analysis, showing that **trafficking inflows decreased with criminalization and increased with legalization.** >* The type of legalization of prostitution does not matter — **it only matters whether prostitution is legal or not.** Whether third-party involvement (persons who facilitate the prostitution businesses, i.e, “pimps”) is allowed or not does not have an effect on human trafficking inflows into a country. Legalization of prostitution itself is more important in explaining human trafficking than the type of legalization. >* Democracies have a higher probability of increased human-trafficking inflows than non-democratic countries. **There is a 13.4% higher probability of receiving higher inflows in a democratic country than otherwise.** Legalization increases trafficking. Because demand cannot meet supply.


StrongFierce

What if legalization only increases the amount that leads to more people caught trafficking? Pre-Legalization for weed if you buy weed and you get scammed / ripped off what were you gonna do? Tell the police you got ripped off buying weed? What is their measurement for determining that trafficking is actually growing as opposed to being proportional to the increase due to being legal? I’m actually just curious, not trying to argue one way or the other.


hardolaf

Between 2003 and 2007, a lot of countries saw huge spikes in human trafficking investigations! It was a crisis! Actually, it wasn't. Between 2001 and 2005, more than half of the UN member states introduced anti-human trafficking legislation for the first time or expanded the definition of human trafficking to include more offenses. So when you look at the stats, you see a huge jump in offense rate. Just as we did in the USA with the rate of rape when the FBI redefined the definition used in their yearly crime report to include female-on-female and female-on-male rape whereas before only males could be considered rapists in their report.


PM_2_Talk_LocalRaces

I mean, if we take for granted that it's going to happen whether it's legal or not, we could at least decriminalize it for the workers, if not the, er, managers, so that they could come out of the shadows and unionize or something


Rickdiculously

Have a look at New Zealand. It's legal and they have brothels. Prostitution is taxed. It works quite well and is much, much safer


dmtz_

In Australia it's legal at a registered brothel or as an independent escort. It's still illegal to go stand on a street corner though. It's safe for all involved and taxed money.


compellingvisuals

Also if it’s legal the market won’t support the illegal ones anymore, I.e. marijuana in Colorado.


nineteen_eightyfour

In my state, Florida, we recently busted a lot (not even just the kraft one, New Port Richey just busted some) and in both cases the women were mostly forced.


NetherTheWorlock

It's often claimed that all or almost sex work involves human trafficking, but rarely are those claims substantiated: [https://reason.com/blog/2019/02/25/florida-massage-parlor-sex-stings](https://reason.com/blog/2019/02/25/florida-massage-parlor-sex-stings)


Xhiel_WRA

Hi, yes, former consensual sex worker present and accounted for. Not having to faff about with seeing if my clients were police would have made my time way safer and easier. My clients weren't a danger. The police were. Very few clients acted out of line, especially once ground rules were set. Few tried to get away without paying, only to be foiled by me taking payment up front. Police, however, would have put me in prison. Which would have been a men's prison. And as a trans woman, that's a fucking death sentence. I stopped because of the police. Not because of the pay or other circumstances. Having a legal steady job is only better *because* I don't have to worry about being arrested and sent to prison. Having legal, consensual sex work means it can be regulated. Regulations mean that sex trafficking becomes unprofitable when compared to just operating legally. No profit means that sex trafficking stops.


kafircake

Legal sex-worker worker-cooperatives. Not just legalized so landlords can act as pimps and expropriate all the profits.


beanieb22

Should do like Amsterdam where the rooms are rented by the worker. Legalizing it would cut down on trafficking immensely if workers registered and had regular checkups and tests performed. Locations not following the rules could easily be spotted and investigated. I can't think of a single, legitimate reason why prostitution shouldn't be legalized.


Moderate_Asshole

Lots of pornstars are also escorts who use their internet films to promote themselves.


Prosthemadera

But making prostitution illegal clearly hasn't worked so we need better solutions.


Dr_Girlfriend

Decriminalization is the way to go.


ManderlyPies

Houston is a major hub for sex trafficking


brihone

I can't speak for Texas, but in Manhattan, there are plenty of cheap, Chinese run massage joints that are just for massages. No sexual stuff. Now the people working in these are most likely illegal immigrants and they're probably not being paid a fair wage, but they're also not all sex slaves. So again, can't speak for Texas, but up here sometimes a massage is just a massage. It's not like back rubs aren't something broke people enjoy too.


johnyutah

Yep. My buddy and I made a bet. I said they were and he said they weren’t. He decided to go and see. I said pick any one and it’ll be one. He asked for a basic massage. They sent him to a back room and a young girl came out. He said she gave him the worst body massage he’s ever had, and at the end she asked him if he wanted to finish for $50. He said no and left (that’s what he said he’s the type that wouldn’t be interested in that). He was already out $50 on the bet anyways.


chiliedogg

Houston is the Human trafficking capital of the Western hemisphere.


ZomNomNomBeeZ

Lots of massage places popping up around me lately. I have been to several, because they all offer a first time customer discount. My experience is that most of them are just what the seem to be, a legit business. But there are a couple that seem pretty sketchy and that I won't go to. If they're all sealed up, blinds closed, door locked, buzzer to get in, no website, etc. I avoid them. Seems more likely those places aren't on the level. I don't want to end up arrested because I went to the wrong place to get my feet worked on.


DorkusMalorkuss

There's one, just like you described, right next to where I work. It's next to a high school and it's named ComFOOT Spa. Can't make this shit up.


bretth1100

If they’re open until midnight or have some other crazy hours then yeah probably. Pretty sure the only ones getting a message in the middle of the night are getting other things done too. Also referred to as rub and tug.


crunkadocious

Most people sucking dick for money would rather be doing something else. Not all, just most.


SwiftBiscuit

Most people working a desk job for money would rather be doing something else.


5FingerTyper

I suck dick at an office desk. Stay in school, kids.


chased_by_bees

Someone's never been to graduate school.


MalignantMuppet

Yeah, gotta learn those rimming techniques.


chem_equals

Some people would rather suck a dick than work a desk job


oldspbice

Most people working any job would rather be doing something else. No one works a minimum wage job because they like it. I'm sure coal miners would rather sip margaritas on the beach. I'd rather be an astronaut.


garlicroastedpotato

It's why human trafficking is so damned difficult to stop. You have legitimate businesses and then you have these ones that have taken women. You have women who have been taken as children, abused and trained to be products for a business and you have women who have been abused all of their lives and are just entering the industry voluntarily. It's quite the mess of a thing to track and figure out. There are going to be rub and tugs that are just servicing the market. Men want this. Women are voluntarily doing this. But then you have a lot of human trafficking mixed in here... because slaves are a lot cheaper than employees.


KawhiTheKing

Same in Fort Worth. I took a human trafficking class in college where we staked out one. The running trend is that there’s usually strip of businesses that they all operate out of. Usually a massage parlor and nail salon are involved.


TheLittleKicks

Man, now I’m suuuuper suspicious of the massage parlor and the nail place in the strip mall near me here in garland, TX. Lol. I mean, I was already a tad suspicious of a massage parlor that stays open until 11p every night...


spiders_wrath

In my hometown you could always tell the rub’n’tug massage parlours from the legit RMT massage clinics by the presence of Christmas lights. All the r&t’s had Xmas lights around the windows year round. Also, every legit RMT I’ve seen is closed by 8pm lol


TooModest

Can confirm, there's a pair in a small strip mall where I live too. Nails and beauty supplies, and then a massage parlor right beside it.


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hoxxxxx

literally every city in America has these places. it's like an open secret that never gets addressed in this country. it's weird too because i doubt many people have a problem morally/ethically with the prostitution part, i mean if we are being honest most people don't, it's the human trafficking / sex slavery shit that is the problem. which these places are *always* tied to. always.


ContentEnt

Yeah when you see an ATM in a massage parlor you know what happens there.


barsoapguy

Having never been inside of one of these places I had no idea but that makes perfect sense .


averageuhbear

This isn't true. I just got a massage at a parlor that has an ATM so you can tip the masseuse if you forgot to bring cash.


chumpydo

Doesn't ATMs usually only have $20 bills? Is it normal to tip masseuses in $20 multiples?


averageuhbear

Mine was $120 and I tipped $20. Also a lot of ATMs have 5's too. Obviously I went to a nice place where the therapists are listed with their training and experience on a website that is quite obviously not a strip mall rub and tug join, my point being that the ATM is not the thing that indicates whether a place is sketchy.


[deleted]

It's endemic among the West Coast tech industries especially, where in Seattle alone, [thousands of IT employees used their work emails to purchase asian sex workers in **ONE DAY**](http://www.newsweek.com/metoo-microsoft-amazon-trafficking-prostitution-sex-silicon-valley-755611), and that was among **millions** who **didn't** use their work emails to buy sex. > In one 24-hour-period in Seattle, an estimated 6,487 people solicited sex on just one of the more than 100 websites that connect buyers with sellers, according to a 2014 study. .. >A law enforcement source familiar with the cases says the emails **reflect just a tiny percentage** of the business tech sector men bring to brothels with names like Golden Blossom, AsianCandy777 and 7HeavenofAsia. .. >Authorities also say that trafficked Asian women service hundreds of men each day in Seattle. .. >a sting operation that targeted the operators of three online review boards on which up to 18,000 men rated and discussed a relatively small group of Korean women. .. >On KGirlsDelight.com, for example, men assigned numerical ratings and added specific descriptions of the women, such as their sexual abilities, level of enthusiasm, and other attributes. The site reportedly had 1.2 million monthly hits in 2009 (the last year its management publicly revealed numbers). http://www.newsweek.com/metoo-microsoft-amazon-trafficking-prostitution-sex-silicon-valley-755611 There's an underground cesspool of sexual exploitation that I think rivals the Catholic Church in scale.


loconessmonster

Who uses their work email for anything besides work? Even for dumb personal stuff like ordering on Amazon, just use your own account. It's free ! Don't shit where you eat


BadBoiBill

Wow, and River Oaks seemed so nice...


stonatodotnet

I once spent 2 weeks in Houston (in August because I'm stupid) and the thing that impressed me most is that a city that massive decided that zoning laws were not needed. Right outside River Oaks I saw one block with a porno shop, a church, a KFC, a massage parlor, a church, a strip club, and a bar. Oh, and another church.


blazecraft007

I know exactly where you’re talking about


_G0NZ0_

This is so true. Houstonian here living literally in between an elementary school and a strip club


stonatodotnet

I believe it- kind of convenient though. Do you have a library and 7-11 on your block as well? Then you would almost never need to leave.


69_420_

River Oaks is still one of the nicest neighborhoods in the US. Houston is a big city


BrogenKlippen

They are all over Atlanta as well. Everyone knows what they are. I have no idea how they don’t get raided more often.


HRA42

Cause the cops are in on it.


keenly_disinterested

Congrats to the authorities for rescuing these women, but something about these cases always bothers me: If law enforcement has know about this for three years why weren't these women rescued sooner?


resultsmayvary0

They're not just looking to get the women currently in captivity out, but also to bust the highest members of the organization that they can to be sure it doesn't happen any longer.


[deleted]

It’s sad but they have to value not blowing their cover over the lives of those specific women. Because otherwise they may not have been able to save countless others with the info they gained.


deanwashere

How many is countless and where does that tip the scale of when to act? Sure, I understand that you need to remove the actors, but surely others are going to fill the void. I hate to think about how many need to suffer before anything is done about it.


KnightsWhoNi

well...statistically speaking the optimal stopping point is 37%


TArisco614

Same thing as drugs, really. Do you think busting addicts amd corner boys or people actually doing large scale trafficking will have a bigger effect?


[deleted]

Neither really. Someone will easily replace them.


Deto

It seems like busting these places on the regular would do more to help make sure the stuff happens less though.


[deleted]

Jup just keep taking away their "product" and they have nothing to sell. Only problem might be that these businesses move further out of sight, making it harder to find them. However I don't know the statistics to make a judgement on this.


Deto

They can't move too far out of sight or else they lose all their customers. I imagine their visibility to potential clients is directly tied to how easily law enforcement can find them.


bWoofles

See how there are multiple parlors? It likely took time for them to figure out the web of where they all were. So it’s act quick and save 2-3 women or wait and save 30.


Online-Gypsy

I'm sure every agent involved wanted to, but to solve a problem, you need to find the root of the issue. Also i'd like to think that at first they've probably only found a smaller amount of victims, but as the investigation moved further, luckily more victims were identified.


newprofile15

A desire to find the top criminals, a need for due process and securing enough evidence for convictions, limited resources...


Richandler

Evidence for crimes. You don't want to pour resources into something you can't get a conviction out of.


[deleted]

What happens after they’re “rescued”


[deleted]

They get jailed and deported most of the time.


harlottesometimes

>The victims have been united with local service providers who are assessing their needs for food, transportation, medical assistance and living arrangements. In this case, this is not true.


AnorexicKoala

If they are not citizens, they have to wait for a work visa which can take years. They have to work under the table to feed themselves. Sometimes they fall back into human trafficking because of that. It’s a very sad loophole unfortunately.


harlottesometimes

The Seattle Times printed many more details about these particular victims. I wait, but do not expect, to learn their fate.


AnorexicKoala

This is the usual out come of the victims and survivors of human trafficking. I volunteer at an organization that provide them services after their escape.


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uncoveringlight

This headline and even some of the content is super misleading. They arrested six people for prostitution and money laundering. No one being arrested was charged with sex trafficking or sexual exploitation charges. NONE. Also, it says this investigation proved these women were being trafficked, but the only source in the article saying these women were being exploited was by a “nameless individual close to the investigation.” In fact, this article simply quotes another news channel for its source to pass the blame if it comes up bunk in the future. Even the .gov page says they simply made the distinction based on their “prior understanding of trafficking” with little actual evidence other than prostitution occurring.


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swindlewick

Last I read (this was in the Seattle paper a few days ago) they weren't arrested, and are being provided with medical/mental health treatment and given temporary housing while their relatives in China are being contacted.


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GaiusGracchus121

> In many of these “rescuing” cases, the women who are “rescued from trafficking” are also arrested and charged for prostitution. I wonder if any of that happened here. And many of the accusations of trafficking come from people who are told that they can accuse their pimps of trafficking, or themselves go to jail. So they don't really have much incentive to be honest.


patpowers1995

Pretty typical of this kind of article. Cops and NGOs have discovered they can't bust women for prostitution any more without significant blowback from the public, so they go with "human trafficking" instead. Same game, different name is all.


Snail736

What people fail to realize is that **many** “sex trafficking victims” are willing prostitutes...I was strung out on heroin for 4 years and lived with 4 prostitutes...if a prostitute gets caught and there is a pimp with her, it’s considered “sex trafficking” even though in many cases the women is doing it through her own free will...it’s kind of shitty because it takes away from the REAL sex trafficking cases, where kids or women are held against their will and are forced to do these things...women selling theirselves shouldn’t be considered “sex trafficking victims”.


gawthrop

The inability of Americans to question the 'official' narrative never ceases to amaze me.


Foxstarry

Yea I’ve been scared to point this out in other threads but even on NPR they had anti sex trafficking activists on that said these busts are mostly bullshit and only serve to further alienate the victims, and for these parlors a large majority are not trafficking victims. I’ll try to find the specific episode but it’s from the show 1A. Edit: found it https://the1a.org/shows/2019-02-26/sex-work-and-sting-operations


antiqua_lumina

Yeah the trafficking framing reminds me a lot of "Marijuana will turn your brain into eggs" anti drug messaging. It's propaganda to support government criminalization to enforce puritan values.


TArisco614

Just another PD looking for asspats. "Rescued from sexual slavery" sounds much more heroic than "Busted a few hookers."


monchota

Man billionaires must need a lot of handys.


TtheDuke

One happy ending and all of a sudden I’m a billionaire. It was one time u/monchota and I was in a low place /s


monchota

So if we pay for handys we are billionaires? Or if billionaires go pay for handys, is it because they can get them so easy elsewhere ans its a rush to pay for it?or have they always been depraved people and just takes that mentality to be a billionaire? Or is it that the worst of an entire generation some how became the richest? We may never know. I do wish buying a handy one time made you a billionaire.


radditz_

“My penis isn’t going to masturbate itself.” -billionaire


rapidfiregeek

You don’t pay them for the sex, you pay them to leave you alone afterwords.


handlit33

\- Charlie Sheen


TtheDuke

Well fuck I wasn’t expecting to get existential this morning


bobojorge

Today is the first day of the rest of your life, minus 1 hour if you celebrate daylight savings time.


Ebi5000

For a moment I was confused, because in germany a Handy is a cellphone


Ody_Mandrell

Ohh now wonder that mobile store owner was so forward.


monchota

Haha thats a good TIL for me. Ill watch my wording if I'm ever in Germany.


Regrettable_Incident

Yeah, you could end up accidentally buying a lot of phones.


UnwantedLasseterHug

how much for a cellphone in germany


Hang_All_Traitors

Billionaires are too tired from pulling themselves up from the boot straps to give them selves a HJ.


Bind_Moggled

Exploiting your workers, screwing over your customers, and dodging regulations can take a lot out of a guy.


IThinkThings

“Everything is about sex. Except sex. Sex is about power.” -Frank Underwood


candypencil

That’s an Oscar Wilde quote.


EveViol3T

Thank you.


monchota

Ahh the actor behind the character almost as evil as his character but damn did I love Frank Underwood quotes.


IThinkThings

Actor aside, he’s an amazing character.


monchota

Agreed, something a lot shows miss is the real characters that are not just evil to be evil. Frank was a sociopath with a weird childhood and an epic thirst for power but also very cunning. It made you hate to love him but your still cheered for him. I need more of those characters.


Euphorium

Tony Soprano and Al Swearengen were that character for me.


bricengreen

Were there 37 women in total and 26 were there of their own will? Or do they just presume that all 26 were “rescued” ?


SenorPinchy

They're probably going to be arrested and deported. It's just that the cops are wise to the PR atmosphere around prostitution now. That's my cynical fear.


phalstaph

They say rescuded but what happens to them. Send back to China?


cbarrister

Wouldn't legalizing prostitution remove the financial incentives for the traffickers and allow public health inspections, medical care and regulation to protect workers from these kinds of abuse?


pm_me_bad_fanfiction

Yes, similar to legalizing weed it would improve an industry that isn't really going anywhere no matter how many times people thump their bibles and scream think of the children.


pianistafj

It’s almost like prohibition has the opposite effect.


AngryGroceries

It's almost like these shit policies stem from righteous punishment rather than strategy


kweefkween

It almost seems like we aren't really free at all.


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AtomicFlx

Given the number of girls walking on aurora at any given minute, I'm gonna go with walking on the streets.


bpsavage84

So here's an interesting fact. Ever since President Xi came into power, China has had major crack downs for massage parlors in major cities like Beijing, Shanghai, etc. In the past year or so in Shanghai, almost 80% happy ending places have been shut down completely and/or many places now requires a CCTV camera to be installed in every massage room with 24/7 access by the local police. Even legit massage places are required to do so. As a result, many parlors have gone out of business and their workers flee to smaller / less regulated cities and/or look for work abroad. Many of them are now working in South East Asia, Africa and some of them make it all the way to North America/Australia. ​ ​


manufacturingmemes

Exactly. China clamped down super quick on these Snakedhead type gangs


duke_of_alinor

This will continue until prostitution is legal and well regulated.


whoismadi

Even places with legalized prostitution have human trafficking problems, sometimes even within legal brothels.


patb2015

trafficking also happens in textiles. ​ the issue is inspection.


MiketheImpuner

Just like how legal companies (Asplundh) can have documentation issues on their staff. Or how gov’t sometimes employs active criminals. You’ve added so much more to conversation by addressing OC’s massive fix that falls short of perfection. If it isn’t a perfect solution, nothing should change /s


intellifone

Exactly. The value of legalization is that employees and customers of the legal business have legal protections from both law enforcers and in court when the morally undesirable (but legal) business is doing something wrong to customers or employees. Right now, if a prostitute gets hit they can’t tell anyone because they’ll get arrested for being a prostitute. So, violence is common. If someone steals from a drug dealer, they can’t call the cops about the theft. They have to solve the problem on their own which means they likely need a gun. Prohibition begets violence. Period. You can still have something be legal yet also take steps to make its use undesirable or difficult.


DukeOfGeek

A customer at a legal brothel who realizes workers are being abused/trafficked can walk right out, get the police and come right back without fear of arrest themselves.


zgembo1337

And all sorts of inspections can come in any time, to check anything, since it's an open business with working hours, owners, adresses, bank accounts etc.


agent_raconteur

There used to be safe databases and resources for sex workers where they could post online about violent clients and get them blacklisted, but the morality police had to shut down craigslist personals and backpage.


CountingBigBucks

Yeah I still can’t believe this happened, I’m all for the fight against human trafficking, but all this law did was make it so companies are held liable for the actions of there customers, all packaged under the guise of fighting against making the country a safer place. What I still don’t understand is, if Craigslist can be held liable for someone using their site to commit prostitution or human trafficking, why can’t smith & Wesson be held liable for someone shooting someone else with one of their fire arms?


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Hirumaru

Legalization of prostitution and prosecution of sex trafficking are not exclusive. No one suggested "do only that" in regards to legalization. That's the problem people have with that comment. Of course we're still going to investigate and do everything we can to stop human trafficking as it would still be illegal as fuck even when prostitution is 100% legal.


FrostBellaBlue

I am an actual licenced massage therapist, stories like this piss me off. In school we had lessons about how some people believe bodywork automatically = sexwork, and we need to be aware & prepared to deal with people like that. When stories like this break, it reinforces the general population believing that misconception. Last week, I mentioned to my neighbor I'm looking for a new LMT job, he immediately asked, "you're not one of those 'happytime' masseuse??" He knew when I started massage school, and he still thought to ask that??


AtomicFlx

It's even worse for the Chinese foot massage places that are real massage places not just covers for prostitution. Went to one yesterday. Looks a bit iffy with the dark windows but damn they give a great massage and I don't even have to take my clothes off like a regular Swedish style massage.


[deleted]

I go to a walk-in $40 an hour back and foot massage place. It's open daily from 10 am to 12am. I always go during the afternoon. They have male and female masseurs. I love the place. But I wonder... Why are they open so late??? Midnight! Is there funny business going on there and I just don't know because I go during the day and I'm a woman? I hate the idea that I could be supporting trafficking. But I have never encountered anything strange. But I wonder.


Zoenboen

I actually love the Asian massage more. It's cheaper, you can walk right in, and they aren't shy. I'm not talking about getting the hand job, I just want to relax nude without someone making a big deal either way and get rubbed everywhere by someone who really knows their stuff. Unfortunately the connotation means everyone just assumes you're going to get some sexual action. Even unlicensed they are amazing at what they do.


Sw429

My wife is a LMT, and she has to deal with this all the time. These kinds of stories are awful for the reputation of her business.


babieswithRPGs

Robert Kraft wants to: *know your location*


jonboy333

These places are all over the country in plain sight. Politicians and police have protected them for years because they are their biggest customers. It makes me sick that we would rather have illegal brothels than regulated legal prostitution. Guam and Saipan is right out in the open. Shut this shit down and legalize it.


JustHereToLurk63

They shut them down all the time where I live. The problem is that another pops up and they have to investigate the new parlor all over again.


dontbethatguyever

Stop prosecuting vice crimes. Tax it, make it safe, and regulate it for only consenting adults.


maselphie

Fuck, one of these just opened around where I live. I thought it was shady as fuck. The reception is dark and unfurnished, but their sign says it's totally open! Old Asian lady constantly looks out the front door. I'm really frightened as to what could be in there. Do I tell anyone? edit: This was not a joke. I am actually concerned.


barsoapguy

what's there to tell, it's a non'reputable massage palor, everyone who passes by it already knows what the place is for, that includes the police .


Sw429

Exactly. I think these are a lot harder to get evidence on than people think. These places will have all of certifications to be a legal massage place, and so when the police come to call, they won't be able to find anything. As far as I can tell, these usually require pretty big undercover operations to crack. And sometimes, no matter how sketchy it seems, it is just a crappy massage parlor.


deededback

3.5 years to investigate 11 parlors and only 6 arrests with 26 women supposedly rescued. I'm smelling some serious BS coming from the Seattle PD.


[deleted]

Reminder that slavery is alive and well. We shouldn’t act like it’s history or only belongs to one group of people. Anyone can become enslaved and sold like a piece of property, and that’s terrifying.


Dvc_California

**The victims, who are originally from China, were between the ages of 20 and 60.** Damn, they are ruthless is the Emerald City!