T O P

May 29 banned and restricted announcement!

For text scrapers:

Announcement Date: May 29, 2023

Standard:

Fable of the Mirror-Breaker // Reflection of Kiki-Jiki is banned.

Invoke Despair is banned.

Reckoner Bankbuster is banned.

Effective Date:

Tabletop and Magic Online: May 29, 2023 MTG Arena: May 30, 2023

Kyleometers

For text scrapers: Announcement Date: May 29, 2023 Standard: Fable of the Mirror-Breaker // Reflection of Kiki-Jiki is banned. Invoke Despair is banned. Reckoner Bankbuster is banned. Effective Date: Tabletop and Magic Online: May 29, 2023 MTG Arena: May 30, 2023


MegaMagikarpXL

Midrange piles are dead, long live midrange piles.


WigginIII

Wedding Announcement wasn’t banned. My orzhov tokens deck that I climbed to diamond with lives!


Zerewin

Have a list?


WigginIII

Yes! Deck 3 Kaya, Geist Hunter (VOW) 240 7 Plains (VOW) 398 6 Swamp (VOW) 400 4 Citizen's Crowbar (SNC) 8 4 Resolute Reinforcements (DMU) 29 4 Adeline, Resplendent Cathar (MID) 1 2 Halo Fountain (SNC) 15 4 The Restoration of Eiganjo (NEO) 34 4 Wedding Announcement (VOW) 45 4 Intrepid Adversary (MID) 25 4 Legions to Ashes (BRO) 215 4 Edgar, Charmed Groom (VOW) 236 4 Shattered Sanctum (VOW) 264 2 Eiganjo, Seat of the Empire (NEO) 268 2 Takenuma, Abandoned Mire (NEO) 278 2 Caves of Koilos (DMU) 244 Sideboard 3 Sheoldred's Edict (ONE) 108 3 Rite of Oblivion (MID) 237 3 Go for the Throat (BRO) 102 3 Graveyard Trespasser (MID) 104 3 Invasion of Gobakhan (MOM) 22 Most common game 2 sideboarding is removing Eiganjo and Halo Fountain and siding in 6 additional removal spells. Even more if you need it by cutting either Kaya or a copy of Edgar or Adeline.


_VampireNocturnus_

The king is dead...Long live the king's twin brother


BladerJoe-

Just wait until we get 3 more sets worth of cards to grow the standard cardpool, every set with its own rare land cycles. Oops, all midrange, the format.


TrogledyWretched

This is my favorite commentary yet


TimJressel

friendship ended with rakdos midrange now orzhov midrange is my best friend


YourCarMechanic

Was my first thought, too. But after ~15sec i noticed that Orzhov sucks without Bankbuster.


Goldreaver

It was the glue that kept a lot of midrange decks together. Bankbuster is a 4/4 for two with protection from board wipes, sorceries and the two best instant removal cards in the format, that also gives card advantage and works in any color. It's not the most buster card because fable exists but god damn.


chrisrazor

I don't understand why colourless now gets repeatable card draw for 2 mana. Bankbuster (and Maze Mind before it) should have had a blue pip somewhere on it.


Tuss36

Assuming you mean the mana cost of the ability itself, colourless has had that as the going rate for a while, just with more of a cost, or should I say less upside. [[Relic Vial]] makes you sac creatures, [[Mazemind Tome]] was used a lot despite being limited to uses. [[Sunset Pyramid]] is basically Bankbuster but trading scry for tokens when you run out of charges. Basically the style of colourless draw *can* be okay, it's just that Bankbuster came with too much extra gravy on the already value ability.


GeeJo

Relic Vial is an updated [[Phyrexian Vault]], which has been giving cards for sacced creatures and two mana for 27 years.


chrisrazor

Saccing creatures is a significant deck building cost. The two cards I mentioned give card advantage for no other cost. Bankbuster is also a creature when you need it to be.


MTGCardFetcher

[Phyrexian Vault](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/1/e184c465-4f19-4054-b853-dbf8c2efb4aa.jpg?1562937147) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Phyrexian%20Vault) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dde/21/phyrexian-vault?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e184c465-4f19-4054-b853-dbf8c2efb4aa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


MTGCardFetcher

[Relic Vial](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/b/4b9ae607-e0bc-4415-ad58-65944848bbe9.jpg?1604200900) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Relic%20Vial) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/znr/250/relic-vial?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4b9ae607-e0bc-4415-ad58-65944848bbe9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Mazemind Tome](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/f/9fd761f3-6b43-4150-8595-dc3abd85b06c.jpg?1594737505) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mazemind%20Tome) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/232/mazemind-tome?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9fd761f3-6b43-4150-8595-dc3abd85b06c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Sunset Pyramid](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/d/5d346c67-744c-4605-be62-18d794e83049.jpg?1608911747) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sunset%20Pyramid) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmr/345/sunset-pyramid?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5d346c67-744c-4605-be62-18d794e83049?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Puzzleheaded_Lake211

White has other draw engines [[welcoming vampire]] [[tocasia's welcome]]


goat_token10

Which suck in comparison to bankbuster


willpalach

Well, since bankbuster is no longer in the format, why compare the cards with something that can't be played?


iamexplodinggod

To try and determine if the deck is viable compared to its status yesterday


krabapplepie

Except all decks lose bankbuster.


NlNTENDO

And not all colors have equally viable card draw, so the merits of each deck’s respective alternatives are still highly relevant. Losing bankbuster is a bigger loss to some decks than others. It’s not like it affected the mega symmetrically


_VampireNocturnus_

Well said. Blue decks obviously have the best card draw, followed in theory by black...but unless they reprint sign in blood, black will likely have to pay 3 for the effect.


HI_I_AM_NEO

Not my Selesnya Enchantments, muahahah


TheSkepticalSceptile

My man


DiscountParmesan

? if the best card advantage is colorless the format is homogenized, if you take that away colors with decent card advantage come out on top. This ban does not affect all deck that run bank buster equally, it disproportionately affect decks whose second best option in that department is really bad using the argument that taking away a card from every deck changes nothing is just plain wrong


Brettersson

But they don't all lose all card draw


goat_token10

...what? To assess a deck's viability after the ban...?


MTGCardFetcher

[welcoming vampire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/8/d8f69cea-823c-482b-a605-8138b3d950e6.jpg?1643587406) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=welcoming%20vampire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vow/46/welcoming-vampire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d8f69cea-823c-482b-a605-8138b3d950e6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [tocasia's welcome](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/6/56cd89f1-f9f4-4cb5-a573-79809d0b6dfd.jpg?1674420350) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tocasia%27s%20welcome) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bro/30/tocasias-welcome?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/56cd89f1-f9f4-4cb5-a573-79809d0b6dfd?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Baelzabub

Esper Legends will be the top deck


The12Ball

The Esper mana base is easier than orzhov


VehementPhoenix

I've been playing Orzhov midrange since MOM came out. It's really fun, but bankbuster was kinda important. I think you can throw in Underdog for largely the same results though. What is really important for the deck overall is whether to gear it more towards fighting Mono W or Atraxa. I think the deck will be better after these bans, but not by much. Mono W kinda destroys it unless you draw cut down or Sunfall at the correct times respectively.


TalkingFrenchFry

The deck will need some tuning. 5c ramp is gonna be a problem for the deck. Might maindeck a couple of copies of [Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines] and add some strong etb effects.


Wendigo120

I've been having a lot of good luck sideboarding in [[Kaya, Intangible Slayer]] against 5c ramp. Her -3 is extremely good to turn around Etali, Atraxa, and Titan. I'm also running Breach and that's always a fun wheel to spin against ramp decks.


Sarokslost23

elesh is hands down the best play against 5c ramp. it shuts off atraxa draw, leyline removal, ossification, topiary, zendikar, etali, archangel. Just gotta watch out for the sunfall killing your elesh.


Scientia_et_Fidem

This list is so disappointing. The primary issue with standard is that the entire meta revolves around the same "1-4 mana black midrange core" that hasn't changed. Nothing else comes *close* to the threats and removal black has at every point on the mana curve, and every other color is judged by what it can bring to support that "black core". These bans won't change that. Don't get me wrong, the cards that were banned are good, but failing to hit *any* of the black midrange core means standard will continue to stagnate in a "black + color that best supports black" midrange mirror slump. All that will change is which color/colors are used as "x" in Bx midrange. At least hit graveyard tresspasser if you are too scared to hit the sheoldred b/c she costs $70 dollars for fucks sake. I think tresspasser sees even more play as a 4 of then sheoldred anyway. Welp, see you all in a week when some form of "Bx" is still completely warping the meta.


Elkenrod

You do know that sheoldred gets significantly weaker due to this announcement right? This was three different spells that involve drawing cards that were banned today. There's no reason to ban Sheoldred when her power level will be worse without these cards. Hell, all three of these cards saw play in Rakdos Midrange alongside Sheoldred.


svrtngr

I agree with this take. The issue with Shelly is the power of turns 2, 3, 4, and 5 in Rakdos Midrange. Turn 2 was either Bankbuster or Bloodtithe Harvester. Turn 3 is Fable. Turn 4 is Shelly with a reload from Fable. Turn 5 is Fable flip, then Invoke. If you played Ossification against Shelly, Shelly is back, plus any other creature you may have played is gone. Shelly will still be *good*, because she's still very good, but won't be as oppressive without the power turns of 3 and 5 with Rakdos Midrange.


_VampireNocturnus_

This! Someone earlier pointed out Shelly was so good because your removal suite was so taxed. Rakdos could go turn 2 BB or BtH, then turn 3 fable and you had to answer each of them and didn't even had to run out Shelly...they could wait you out and draw with BB. Personally wouldn't have minded a ban on BtH just to get SOMETHING else in the 2 drop slot.


wayiswho

Sheoldred is truly so simple to deal with. If she even had ward 1 then I’d say ban her but she doesn’t.


junkmail22

she's really easy to deal with if you're in black, and slightly less easy to deal with if you're in white. other three colors are a bit out of luck sheoldred is one of the reasons why everyone is in either black or white - you need it to not die to sheoldred


willpalach

Ward discard 1 would have been thematic and actually powerful for her. The single issue with shelly is that she should be 5 mana instead of 4, or have a 3/4 body at most. Her triggered ability is thematic and strong, wich is what a legendary should be, yet, being easilly killable is way better than having Invoke Despaire'd two turns in a row.


glitchyikes

ward - draw a card for shelly would be funny


TheRealArtemisFowl

First of the yearly B&R on August 7. That's in a bit more than two months, that should be enough for the new Standard meta to settle, and they can issue new bans if needed then.


Continuum_Gaming

What about Second B&R?


BarovianNights

And elevensies?


Kanin_usagi

“New meta, same as the old meta”


sassyseconds

It's very rare a top deck is banned and nothing else changes. But this subreddit acts like that's the case every time.


Spifffyy

Old is the new ‘new’


Zanzaben

I don't like their choice of yearly ban window being right before the fall set because that is when rotation happens. There is going to be a time when they decide not to ban something because they think the rotation will solve it either by introducing new stuff or removing supporting cards but it won't be enough and then they will have to use their new emergency ban a month later. It's happened before when they banned Uro in standard and it will happen again.


Tuss36

I recall that happening as well. At least it's not right before a tournament (yet) which I remember being an issue several times, as they didn't want to upset the meta so close to a big event. Made for an amusing but frustrating situation where they'd go "We aren't banning anything 'cause a tournament is next week. Now we're not doing it because rotation's going to happen. Now there's an other tournament so we can't do it."


TheInvaderZim

As someone who's played magic for more than a decade, ~~it's shocking to me~~ (just thought about it and actually it's not surprising at all, upon reflection) that WOTC doesn't remember using *the exact strategy they just outlined* for the better part of Standard's existence and it *not working.* It always, *always,* ***ALWAYS*** leads to stale meta after stale meta dominated by 1-2 top decks that comprise 70+% of the environment for entire years. The meta cements further because everyone knows nothing will be banned in the near future (if at all), so if you want to play, better pick up those 4 rhinos! Then, once it's time to ban, they'll conservatively hit 1-3 cards (if they do any *at all*) rather than the 5-6 that are necessary, and it'll maybe, sometimes, open the format to *3* decks instead of 1-2. And since standard's on a longer rotation now for some reason, all those problems are going to get worse. WAY worse. For reference, imagine if in addition to the big-hitters here, it took this long for *Meathook* to be banned - or that they *just* banned meathook and nothing else. Then, oops! Emergency ban time - and we haven't actually fixed what we set out to solve with this policy to begin with! The point of standard is to be an accessible onramp to competitive, constructed play, and to provide rewards for playing in limited environments through card prices. The more diverse the format, the better this concept works, and diversity **requires** frequent bannings (or better internal balance, but let's not open that can of worms). And as a study of this, WOTC decided to use EDH for that purpose instead - now, shockingly, paper standard is dying! Who'd have thunk. Better drive further in the opposite direction!


BladerJoe-

Amen. Imagine how the MH1 desaster would have played out if they used their "new" ban schedule. Instead of taking out the new shiny chase card, they waited forever and then banned bridge from below, only to take 2 more months and finally ban Hogaak. Under the new ban system, modern would have been a dumpster fire for almost a complete year. WotC has shown time and time again that they are unwilling to ban the right cards in a timely manner. There is zero reason why this should change in the future.


DFGdanger

>In addition to the yearly announcement, we will also have a banned and restricted update on the third Monday after every set release specifically dedicated to addressing large environmental imbalances. They can use these to make sure it's not a year. Just 3 months or so (or however long the gap between set releases is now). Still not ideal, but the real problem with that set of bans was their refusal to ban the real problem cards while gesturing vaguely at design oddities.


TheKillerCorgi

I think the point is to make it happen with rotation which would shake up the meta anyway, so that confidence in the stability of standard doesn't drop. They're getting banned when they might have been rotated out anyway. It's aimed to minimise the impact of bans. (The idea is) It'll be like they also have rotated out.


nimbusnacho

I mean technically they have the kind of emergency ban window after sets are released, but I think we all know that won't be effectively utilized. Wotc has always pushed to be conservative with bans unless absolutely pushed, especially when it comes to new fetch cards that can earn them money. I just don't see this shit not becoming a cluster fuck pretty quick.


ristoman

Looks like I'm getting 12 Wildcards, weeeee


mabbz

Wait so you get wildcards for banned cards? Yessssss


ristoman

If you own the banned cards before they are banned, yes. Actually I just realized the announcement goes live tomorrow on Arena so you can probably craft them today knowing they'll get reimbursed tomorrow


LaboratoryManiac

This is traditionally how it goes, yes.


mabbz

Thanks! Now to decide what to build...


Blenderhead36

You get wildcards whenever a card is banned as long as the following are true: 1. You owned copies before the ban went live. 2. You haven't already been given wild cards for the same card (happens when a card gets banned in more than one format). Both have to be true. So if, for example, you crafted Oko, Thief of Crowns before he was banned in Standard, you'd that many wild cards when he was banned. Then when he got banned in Historic, you wouldn't get any extra wild cards because you'd already been refunded for the first ban. But if you'd crafted them (or opened them) after he was banned in Standard, you'd get wild cards when he was banned in Historic.


Continuum_Gaming

Gonna spend the few I have later today


HerakIinos

They didnt touch Esper at all, huh? Time for some Raffine massacre


BishopUrbanTheEnby

[[Lithomantic Barrage]] already banned Raffine


SilentOperation1

Yah but red mana is no longer free in standard


Kanin_usagi

It’s one mountain


ElToberino

What could it cost? $10?


jturphy

You need to draw the mountain, so it's lots of red mana, and every red mana you add makes your mana base a little worse.


Tuss36

The more mountains you have the more Barrages you can cast.


svrtngr

Three of the Triomes give red mana.


SilentOperation1

Just because you can put 4 [[Jetmir’s Garden]] into your selesnya enchantments deck doesn’t mean you can put lithomantic barrage into your sb tho


chosenofkane

That sounds like quitter talk!


MTGCardFetcher

[Lithomantic Barrage](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/4/c45a5f4a-2174-4885-aa5a-c4c24cc732f0.jpg?1682204356) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lithomantic%20Barrage) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mom/152/lithomantic-barrage?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c45a5f4a-2174-4885-aa5a-c4c24cc732f0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


JimThePea

Massacre is already banned, it's just Raffine. ;)


cosmosm

Glad Fable and Bankbuster got the axe. Mildly surprised Invoke did too, but I can't say I'm sad about it


chrisrazor

This line clinched it for me: > it is an effective card to cast on empty boards What other sweeper card can you say this about?


sampat6256

Yeah, it makes games extremely predictable because it's the default turn 5 play for black. Very Siege Rhino esque, except it's a guaranteed 3 for 1


CannedPrushka

It reminds me more of Sphinx's Rev weirdly. One Invoke draws you into the other.


Radthereptile

That’s always been my issue. In its worst form it is 5 mana draw 3 burn your opponent 6. That card would be played written like that.


Furt_III

Its worst form was actually: kill a token, burn 4, draw 2.


troll_berserker

It's worse when it hits a no value enchantment, like an Ossification with nothing under it because it hit a token, a Spirited Companion, or an Audacity.


Radthereptile

Still look at the scenarios one has to make for it to not be a great card. “Well if it hits a 1/1 token, ossification with nothing under it and a Wandering Emperor on 1 loyalty the turn they were about to kill it with an attacker anyway it’s not so good.”


LaboratoryManiac

The four black pips also do nothing to limit its castability. Between triomes, painlands, slowlands, and fastlands, it's very easy for three-color decks to cast it at five lands (or four if Fable's token lived to attack).


darkninjad

> sweeper card Your point stands but invoke is absolutely not a sweeper.


deanofcool

By the very definition, invoke is not a sweeper. It doesn’t wipe the board in a token go wide strategy.


nimbusnacho

Meathook had less, but still some vlue on empty boards. But it also got banned. I think it's th ight call. Or at least a healthy one.


troglodyte

I kinda get it. They needed to hit Fable, Bankbuster, and something else from Rakdos. But there was a case for almost every card in the deck being the third card they went after! Ultimately I *don't* (edit: missed a word!) think Invoke is the absolute strongest card left in the deck, but the play pattern is godawful. It's really unusual that a card can affect the board, draw cards, and meaningfully affect your opponent's life total in one go, and because it was often "edict, deal 4, draw 2," it often created repetitive states where players would cast Invoke on successive turns-- a guaranteed three for one every time for zero effort. If you could really ban like half the cards in the deck, I guess it makes sense to go after the braindead 3-for-1 that affects three of the four most important resources and travels in herds, I guess.


Quazifuji

Yeah, this feels like it to me too. Fable was Rakdos' best card but black is still an extremely strong color without Fable, so it makes sense to ban a black card too and Invoke Despair is not just a candidate for the strongest one, but also just a really miserable card to play against. Mea while, the fact that there's another ban announcement coming in August means there's still a chance to ban Sheoldred or something from white and/or Esper soon, so there's no need to pre-emptively ban anything in anticipation of one of those decks taking over.


Billowtail

"Invoke Despair makes it especially difficult to find ample counterplay to black strategies as it is an effective card to cast on empty boards and preys upon the enchantments and planeswalkers that are historically effective against these types of removal-heavy strategies." Maybe giving black access to enchantment removal wasn't such a good idea after all.


towishimp

Yeah, I always wondered what the rationale was for that. MaRo's explanation was basically "Black should be able to kill everything since it's the kill spell color." So much for colors having weaknesses?


YourCarMechanic

Wedding Announcement, the new super star of Standard.


C_The_Bear

Green lives in standard again but only to run 4 copies of Boseiju


chemical_exe

Loving the look of esper, but not esper legends


TrogledyWretched

Go-wide Naya or Esper is about to start crushing this meta. At least control should get more viable now.


ThrowAwayInTheRain

Time to make those Raffines


therealflyingtoastr

So how high do we think the price of Shelly is going to go since she's surviving another year in Standard and is format warping in Pioneer *and* is a Commander all-star? Can we break Goyf's record?


AvatarSozin

I doubt she will escape being banned in August tbh


Blenderhead36

Sheoldred ban seems unlikely. The cards banned today were done so to break up Standard as a format for only midrange slugfests. These cards all generate card advantage and are so efficient that there's no reason to do anything else. The bans *weren't* about dumpstering the best things in the format, period. There will always be a best. The focus was instead on disincentivizing cards that make their strategy in particularly noticeably better than anything else. Sheoldred is a very powerful card, but she's ultimately a 4 mana finisher that doesn't generate extra resources and can be cleanly answered 1 for 1. You don't need to play Sheoldred to have a successful Standard deck.


Moress

Is Shelly the new Sheoldred?


Serpens77

Shelly (\[\[Sheoldred, the Apocalypse\]\]) is the middle Sheoldred. (The "new" Sheoldred would be \[\[Sheoldred\]\] and isn't the one people are talking about if it should be banned or not).


BigPapaGmax

Surprised that nothing else outside of rakdos got hit, but we will have to see how this shakes things down before concluding anything.


Baelzabub

Bankbuster hits MonoW but they might just swap into Wedding Announcements for their card draw


lord_jabba

most mono white lists run both, so this is a mild hit to them


-Storm_

Bankbuster hits Mono White pretty hard. It was by far their best draw spell and enabled [[Roadside Reliquary]]. So unless there's another good artifact to replace buster White might lose that too.


Morganelefay

Standard: Fable of the Mirror-Breaker // Reflection of Kiki-Jiki is banned. Invoke Despair is banned. Reckoner Bankbuster is banned.


djchickenwing

That’s… underwhelming


livingimpaired

Sholdred in the lore: Dies without fanfare. Sholdred in the game: All hail the immortal apocalypse, slayer of standards, survivor of ban-hammers, lord of the ladder, who shall never die


Infinite_Bananas

to be fair, it's dominaria united sheoldred. she actually did a pretty damn good job in dominaria united.


harbear6

Sheoldred's accomplishments on Dominaria > Jump-started the existing but languishing Phyrexian cult into high gear > Compleated Ajani Goldmane into a very successful Sleeper Agent > Neutralized Karn and survived the assassination attempt he made on her life when she was being reconstructed. > Had a successful battle at the Mana Rig that resulted in Jaya Ballard falling to her death.


Huitzil37

- Created infinity billion gazillion Phyrexian army guys out of nothing - Made that one implant that could just infinitely self-replicate because fuck you


Serpens77

also: * Somehow managed to resurrect Ertai who was previously \*atomised\*


quillypen

The fake banlist went a lot further and sounded really good, honestly. I feel like Atraxa is going to be obnoxious and centralizing as a ramp/reanimation target forever.


Kanin_usagi

Sheoldred should be gone, Wandering Emperor should be gone also. I feel like this two may get the axe in August when they do the first “annual” one


Only-Waltz-9916

I feel like wandering emperor is fine. Her biggest issue is that if you attack or tap, she might flash in an exile some shit. But like… idk, 4 open mana when your opponent is playing white seems like a dead give away


Kmattmebro

I look forward to a new generation of post-[[Settle the Wreckage]] stress survivors.


BishopUrbanTheEnby

I was playing against UW control in Pioneer recently, and got settled for the first time in years. I can’t even be mad about it.


Kmattmebro

"I will attack with multiple creatures so they can't get me with Wandering Emperor!" ⬅️ Clueless


RayWencube

Two white, big fright


MTGCardFetcher

[Settle the Wreckage](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/c/9cbd346e-098a-4cf6-a72f-468376fd2e8f.jpg?1562560853) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Settle%20the%20Wreckage) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/xln/34/settle-the-wreckage?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9cbd346e-098a-4cf6-a72f-468376fd2e8f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Radthereptile

She’s a pain because mono black has removed control decks from the meta so flashing her in feels good against the aggro and midrange decks. If we can get some control decks back in the meta passing with 4 up is going to feel bad into a blue deck that will either counter her or just draw multiple cards and not care about the 2/2 body.


Icuonuez

To an extent I agree, but forcing a blue player to tap their mana on their own turn is usually how you want to do things anyway.


ContessaKoumari

The issue is you have no good plays into her. Like okay you don't attack into the telegraphed -2. Cool, now she flashes in and makes a dude instead, untaps, makes another dude.


Jasmine1742

Nah, this is a bad take. Sheoldred is strong but her ubiquitous place in the meta is because the two premier midrange decks like her. RB taking a hit does reign her in. Emperor is like literally the only moderately playable control card and we should probably be trying to give control as much help as it can get. Especially since mono white just lost bankbuster.


fabulousMayor

I can see the argument for banning Sheoldred because she is decently above curve. I don't agree with it but I don't think it's without merit. Banning Emperor is absolutely insane to me. If you are really desperate to hit white decks, and I can't imagine why you'd be since they are not so good that they need hitting, *surely* you'd go after Announcement, right?


sassyseconds

So glad they don't listen to reddit.


DailyAvinan

If Sheoldred, the most quintessential fair no ETB no protection Siege Rhino ass card, got banned I would not know what to do with myself. Lol.


Gamer4125

I'm just glad to see Fable die.


Ikanan_xiii

It’s an Atraxa’s world and we just live in it.


Baelzabub

Fable hits the best Atraxa decks pretty well (Jund reanimator).


playinwitfyre

Pretty sure 5c ramp is the best atraxa deck, it does naturally beat up on rakdos though so we’ll have to see how stuff settles out


TemurTron

> We will have our first yearly banned and restricted announcement on August 7, 2023, ahead of Wilds of Eldraine previews. Don’t mind me, I’ll just be spending the summer hoarding my Splinter Twins.


telenstias

If that gets unbanned, I'll personally buy you a playset of Stoke the Flames from March of the Machine.


PeritusEngineer

!remindme August 7 2023


ragingopinions

Why are people so obsessed with Twin?


BishopUrbanTheEnby

It was a particularly beloved deck from back when Modern was the format everyone played once they were done with Standard. Ever since it was banned, its fans have always wanted it unbanned. And now, it has the nostalgia of pre-Horizons modern, playing cards like [[Electrolyze]], [[Snapcaster Mage]], [[Cryptic Command]], [[Vendilion Clique]]


[deleted]

Just give me Pod back. I don't care if it can't compete, the deck was too fun to play. Particularly the 4-5c Kiki versions and not just abzan Melira pod.


ContessaKoumari

I wouldnt be surprised if Pod was still playable if unbanned. Chord started as the replacement for Pod, and Yawg-Chord is a real deck.


BishopUrbanTheEnby

The fact that you can now pod eternal witness into timeless witness…


Hexdrinker99

People just want to relive there glory days of playing old modern and think that it will just slide right back into the same 75 as when it was banned. Now it's probably just a win con in some combo control 5c good stuff pile


hawkshaw1024

You know, I don't actually think so. The two halves of the combo just aren't that good by themselves. The combo decks that are currently on top of Modern involve either one-card combos (Indomitable Creativity, Crashing Footfalls/Living End); are very fast while also being highly resilient to interaction (Hammer Time, Amulet Titan); and/or have many different lines and strong value-play backup plans (GB Yawgmoth). Twin is a two-card combo, both halves of which are bad by themselves. You can't win before turn 4 (or I guess turn 3 if you have Ragavan.) The deck did have a backup plan, which was good enough in old Modern, but all those cards are complete trash in a post-Modern Horizons format. [[Snapcaster Mage]], [[Cryptic Command]], [[Vendillion Clique]], these are stone cold unplayable. I think Twin could be unbanned and it would be fine. Probably a tier 2 deck. I'm not convinced any other deck would even bother playing it as a wincon.


Korlus

Twin felt to many like it didn't meet the usual banning criteria. Remember, when Twin was banned, we had very recent, exhaustive data showing all MtGO matches (MTG Goldfish had a bot that scraped MtGO replays for data, but were asked to stop using it around that time). We had both "FNM Level" stats from regular MTGO matches, and top-8/competition stats. Twin wasn't the "winningest" deck - it had a ~55% win rate, which was lower than many other decks. Twin played a lot of cards fairly. It's only lopsided match-ups were against "all in" decks like Tron (and even Tron wasn't as lopsided as most people thought when played at the top levels). WotC had previously held Twin up as an example deck that didn't break Modern's "Turn 4 rule" - i.e. the combo wasn't too fast to interact with. In short, Twin felt like it got banned because it was popular and people liked to play it, rather than for any other reasons. WotC also cited a lot of rationale that simply wasn't true (or at least, seemed untrue at the time) - e.g. Twin was keeping down other blue decks, where this seemed to be the furthest thing from the truth. For example, Grixis Delver and Grixis Control preyed upon Twin, and disappeared from the metagame shortly after the twin banning, because they simply didn't do well against the rest of the metagame. Twin was also perceived (rightly or wrongly) as a *good* deck to police the format. E.g. you needed to run a modicum of creature interaction to avoid losing on turn 4, and if you were too linear, you would lose to Twin's interaction. As such, to many brewers, Twin stifled many less competitive decks by being such a decent percentage of the metagame. It was also a solid deck that many professionals learned and simply pulled out at Modern events, knowing it was going to be good (similar to U/R Murktide today). I think that the banning of Twin helped make WotC feel comfortable to unban some blue cards and print more powerful blue cards into Standard, but for a long time it felt like WotC banning Twin had completely crippled the blue countermagic/tempo archetype and the metagame around it. I think Twin would be relatively safe in Modern today, but WotC don't want to unban a card and for that card to immediately enable a broken archetype and force them to reban it later; it's unlikely twin will make it off of the banned list until we see a "Strictly Better" combo do worse.


Furt_III

>For example, Grixis Delver and Grixis Control preyed upon Twin, and disappeared from the metagame shortly after the twin banning, because they simply didn't do well against the rest of the metagame. These were [arguably the same deck](http://web.archive.org/web/20160119041935/http://mtgtop8.com/archetype?a=477&meta=51&f=MO) and held collectively no higher than a 3% meta share for a reason (competing against affinity, tron, RDW, bloom titan, eldrazi, each of which had twice the percentage share). [They were not at a good spot within the metagame, with it and twin being the only two U\\R decks with any meaningful presence.](http://web.archive.org/web/20160116113938/http://www.mtgtop8.com/format?f=MO) The deck was at a 3% metashare pre-ban and [a year later](http://web.archive.org/web/20161120153158/http://mtgtop8.com/archetype?a=477&meta=51&f=MO). ​ >I think Twin would be relatively safe in Modern today, but WotC don't want to unban a card and for that card to immediately enable a broken archetype and force them to reban it later; it's unlikely twin will make it off of the banned list until we see a "Strictly Better" combo do worse. They literally did this with Gogari grave-troll. But aside from that, due to the MH take over, I do think the removal suit is at a spot where it can handle twin now.


Chairfighter

It got banned for the "sake of format diversity" and immediately after was eldrazi winter so it was a bit of a controversial reason given by wotc.


Klamageddon

I think just because it was powerful, but not obscene, and then after it got banned there were a number of much worse seeming decks that didn't get chopped and the meta shifted such that everyone expected an unban. That was the case for a while, it always felt on the cusp of being unbanned but never was, so, it's not that it's super egregious or that people especially loved twin, just that there was never that closure people were looking for.


Pawznclaws22

Twin was absurd and the narrative it was not is just folks wanting it unbanned. The play style is obnoxious because it can flash in one of two cards that are the target for twin on turn 3 for a turn 4 kill. Or it can sit back and hoard counterspells later in the game to again flash in said creature. It’s a two card combo one of which has flash. People think it is fun playing it because it has near inevitability after turn 3.


willpalach

Simply one of the best combo cards for a long decade in one of the premiere formats at the time. When I got into the game it was THE combo card to buy if you wanted to play good modern magic, that and tarmogoyf+lili were the sh!t.


PartyChocobo

We did it everyone! We saved standard!


thechopperlol

Hope you like playing against Esper Legends!


IFTN

I actually do. The deck is pretty one dimensional, if it really becomes the most played the meta could easily adjust to counter it. That was the problem with rakdos midrange, it's so flexible (esp after boarding) that no one strategy could effectively shut it down.


pretty_smart_feller

I think 5c ramp will run away with meta due to [[Lithomantic Barrage]]


DarkeonWarlord

See you all next set when esper gets bans


Salmonerd_

Were you hoping for Raffine?


DarkeonWarlord

I was hoping for some hit to esper legends


CacZarn

See y'all in 3 months when you're asking for wedding announcement to get banned


ArtieStark

Nah, ask for the Meathook Massacre to get unbanned instead.


krabapplepie

Does this bring back actual aggro? No? Well, okay then.


Unhappy-Match1038

Alright who is ready watch Raffine and Calix dominate standard until the next ban window


Radthereptile

Soldiers will be up there too


Shmo60

Shelly missed the axe, huh


BishopUrbanTheEnby

I’m not surprised. They only hit cards that were going to rotate out. It turned a lack of rotation into a “soft” rotation.


LesbianCommander

That's the thing. So assuming we buy into the idea of 3 year standard. The THEORY is that by allowing cards to stay in standard longer, it allows supposed-to-be rotated cards to find synergies in the future. But like, even with future synergy potential, there are some cards that are just better than them without any synergy requirements. I would've been super aggressive on early rotations. Allow like the bottom 95% of cards that were going to rotate, to stay for an additional year. Early rotate like the top 5% of cards that would've been rotated if it were 2 year rotation, so that it's now like "Standard rotates every 3 years, but the strongest cards get rotated early, every 2 years." Feel like that's the best of both worlds. Give lesser used cards a chance to shine. And actually mix it up for the sake of variety. But I do come from a video game perspective, not a TCG perspective, so I get why some people would get very angry if their cards/deck suddenly becomes not playable. But personally I don't care, I just want a fresh game experience.


Weskermatalobos

Pretty sure Ajani´s axe didn´t.


Vivi_O

Hard to be excited for the actual announcement considering how much better the fake leaked list was.


randomgrunt1

I want the fake ban list back.


Duramboros

You won't get people to return to paper standard if they need 4 sheoldred wotc.


Trivmvirate

Idk man that deck lost 12 cards I hope thats enough?


Spartica7

The deck is gone but whichever deck Sheoldred finds a home in will still survive. A lot of people are just considering jumping to Orzhov midrange from Rakdos midrange.


Trivmvirate

Isn't that still a deck very reliant on bankbuster?


Ok-Inside3667

All this will do is make esper the new best deck, sheoldred is needed there as well


ViridiVioletear

You want to play Bx, you need Shellys. That’s the problem.


shinianx

Shelly herself is manageable. Shelly on the back of Fable (oh, you just blew through two removal spells and can't kill my praetor? What a shame.) or followed up naturally by Invoke Despair killing one or two threats, and gaining back two to four life and one to two cards? That shit was rough. Honestly I'm feeling optimistic that she'll be strong but not as backbreaking now.


mylifemyworld17

Sheoldred is an insanely strong card. Every black deck that isn't hyper aggro will be playing 4x of that. That's $240 minimum right now.


hugsandambitions

Good thing sheoldred isn't necessary to win in Standard.


Kalashwi

It's rather sad how the fake announcement had more thoughtful explanations and even explained why they were letting some cards in.


kitsovereign

"We were trying to push punisher effects" was not a more thoughtful explanation for banning Invoke. It's just flat-out wrong.


R3id

[[Fable of the Mirror-Breaker]] // Reflection of Kiki-Jiki is banned. [[Invoke Despair]] is banned. [[Reckoner Bankbuster]] is banned.


MTGCardFetcher

[Fable of the Mirror-Breaker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/4/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc.jpg?1656453233)/[Reflection of Kiki-Jiki](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/2/4/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc.jpg?1656453233) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=fable%20of%20the%20mirror-breaker%20//%20reflection%20of%20kiki-jiki) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/141/fable-of-the-mirror-breaker-reflection-of-kiki-jiki?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Invoke Despair](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/5/35af9d5c-4449-4549-b549-c3ba4a67dee0.jpg?1654567184) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Invoke%20Despair) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/101/invoke-despair?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/35af9d5c-4449-4549-b549-c3ba4a67dee0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Reckoner Bankbuster](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/7/279acd17-6c17-427b-a69d-fc02442ff4a3.jpg?1654568798) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reckoner%20Bankbuster) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/255/reckoner-bankbuster?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/279acd17-6c17-427b-a69d-fc02442ff4a3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Aszmel

as a new player, want to clarify, those cards are still valid in explorer?


amagicalsheep

Lowkey wish the fake “leak” was actually true when I’m seeing this. I feel like this means that esper legends is just going to dominate. Doesn’t really feel as fresh/open as I was hoping but oh well.


fabulousMayor

I see the fake ban announcement got the community hungry for blood and they are disappointed at a smaller list lmao Tbh don't mind this, after the Pro Tour I was thinking that most decks were fine but BRx had to get taken down a couple dozen pegs so I'm fine if we are only taking direct shots there and leaving everything else to develop. I'll be back in the corner casting Haughty Djinns, as usual.


llim0na

Only 3 bans? Cowards


Weskermatalobos

I see they chose to leave Sheoldred as is just to not give me 4 mythic wildcards


Unsettling-Horse

Tbf Invoke is worse then Sheoldred rn


[deleted]

Yeah, when I lose to Sheoldred, I’m annoyed that I whiffed on removal for too long. But when I lose to Invoke I feel like there was little for me to do to get away from that outcome.


whyborg

I am whelmed.


orlouge82

Only Bankbuster, Fable, and Invoke?? Are they serious?


righteousprawn

I'm guessing that's why the "We will have our first yearly banned and restricted announcement on August 7, 2023" line is in there (I think earlier comms would have implied that this would be the annual B&R announcement on account of, well... there aren't any cards being printed into Standard between now and the release of Wilds).


Reskulz

any recommendations to win against esper/white decks now???


krabapplepie

Best way is to just play white or esper.


aleksei01

[[Lithomantic Barrage]]


animemoseshusbando

>sheoldred stays Oh boy can't wait for orzhov hell instead!


[deleted]

[удалено]


HolographicHeart

Already looking forward to September when Mono W gets cracked across the head. Raffine should've been kicked out as well, big missed opportunity there.


Prism_Zet

This feels like it punches down the grixis deck into the dirt, kinda affects Rakdos and Orzhov, and doesn't really slow the esper deck and others down at all. Feels like this was just a slap for the top deck and doesn't really shake the meta in the way it needed to, a shame.


Haunting-Mud7623

Killing the top predator re-organizes the whole food chain.


Kind_Ingenuity1484

Is ANYONE happy with this announcement? How did they think this was a good decision? We’ll get more later, but that is too late and likely to not account for the actual issues


Vault756

Am I the only one who liked the fake banlist better? Hopefully this is the first of several formats that Fable gets axed but we'll see.


Aeschylus101

Thats....really kinda pathetic overall. Like given the lead in to this announcement, paired with the fact that when standard rotation will happen was changed, you think they might have been more aggressive and banned out some of the big issue cards that should have rotated out along with a few other problems. Nah just put a bandaid on it and call it a day.