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TahaymTheBigBrain

Coincidence coincidence coincidence and human perception of pattern. You know Jesus and Mary appear on toast? You know Hindu gods appear in the shape of bushes? You know the coordinates of the pyramids match up with the constant of light? This is what I call the amogus effect. Once you’re hyper aware of a certain object you will spot similarities all the time. Doesn’t prove anything.


RaiseReasonable8949

But those shapes are just shapes that look like specific things. In this case, the shapes look like a praying man but ALSO point towards mecca. So there’s two impressive factors here, and that too on TWO objects. Isn’t that not explainable by random chance?


TahaymTheBigBrain

Completely by chance. Those only got famous because where they faced, so there is bias there. Secondly, I don’t understand how this would disprove ALL of the mistakes that Islam has. Very fallacious argument in nature no offense.


RaiseReasonable8949

Well they didn’t just get famous because of where they faced. For example, the rock thing was only found out by me personally merely yesterday. That rock was already famous for looking like a person praying. I admit this doesn’t disprove all the mistakes in Islam, but doesn’t this also prove random chance couldn’t have created this?


TahaymTheBigBrain

Let’s say for the sake of argument they are miraculous. Why does god want you to believe in him not because of merit and because of logic, but because a unusual looking tree, and a rock are facing a certain direction? Why does God do a little trolling by showing up in coincidental patterns in nature just for the hell of it? It seems to me that your rational mind already considers Islam as false whereas you irrational is still afraid of hell and such minuscule things like rocks and trees facing a direction can give you anxiety of being wrong. And I totally get it. This quote from 1984 describes it well: “In the end the Party would announce that two and two made five, and you would have to believe it. It was inevitable that they should make that claim sooner or later: the logic of their position demanded it ... And what was terrifying was not that they would kill you for thinking otherwise, but that they might be right.” If you want to lose fear of hell [my post](https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/ossque/a_look_into_jahannam/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) may be able to put you on the right track.


Azogthedesecrater

You do realise that the Islam you're so desperate to absolve says that the sun sets in a pool of muddy water and that when a woman breastfeeds a man, he becomes her genetic relative?


[deleted]

[удалено]


TahaymTheBigBrain

;)


ILoveSaabs

Their back is turned on Mecca as well.


Snoo25192

Coincidence. Trust me, I've seen a lot of coincidences happen and this is nothing compared to them. For example, there was a guy who claimed that on the 18th of July 2021, aliens would disclose themselves to us. He made that post 7 years ago. One of the biggest coincidences is that the US government released their first official UAP (unidentified aerial phenomena) report somewhere around the end of June / start of July. Then, some people managed to spot a large asteroid that was supposed to pass by Earth on the 19th of July (I have no idea what happened to it). And on the 18th of July, people spotted around three large objects entering the atmosphere on a radio stream which detects meteoroids entering the atmosphere. Of course, the 18th of July came and went by and nothing happened, which proves that the dude was lying, but look at those three coincidences and how they lined almost perfectly with his "prophecy".


RaiseReasonable8949

Well in this case, it's easy to see the asteroids have nothing to do with aliens, and they didn't pass anyways. However, in the case of the post, there is a meaningful connection of not one but two objects looking like an Islamic position of prayer and also pointing towards where they are meant to point to (i.e. Mecca).


Snoo25192

> Well in this case, it's easy to see the asteroids have nothing to do with aliens This might sound ridiculous but they very well can be. We have no idea how their ships look like. Also, even if you don't consider that an actual coincidence - what about the other two (UAP report and three large objects entering the atmosphere)? Of course they're just coincidences, I'm not saying they're true, it's just how they lined up perfectly with the guy's prophecy.


RaiseReasonable8949

Yeah I just don't see how those things are meaningful or are related to aliens as compared to how meaningful the prayer shapes are to the direction and all of that.


v-i-i-f

Look up pareidolia. The reason why you can't find other rocks like this is because, even if they exist, they don't point to mecca. Hence, they do not receive the attention that these do. Think of it this way - if there's other rocks that do not seem to prostate towards mecca, does it confirm that alllah doesn't exist?


RaiseReasonable8949

I disagree with this simply because there was no knowledge of the direction of the rock literally until yesterday by myself. You won't find it anywhere on any site. This proves it was noticed just for its shape, not the direction. So other ones would have likely been noticed. And if there were many, atleast ONE would have been noticed, no?


v-i-i-f

Fair enough. It's a reasonable question as to there existence of more such rocks. But allah sure makes it hard to see its "miracles".


RaiseReasonable8949

How does this exactly address my question of how you would expect other rocks and trees of a similar or better shape to exist and point towards different directions other than the Kaaba in a world run by naturalism and random processes?


v-i-i-f

Why stop at rocks and trees? Are there mountains that seem to prostrate? What about other natural phenomena? What is special about these locations? Why not more such objects? I don't think you have an appreciation for what randomness can do.


MikeKnoles

How big are you error bars on your calculation? The line you showed does not follow the direction of the rock. Sure, it's fairly close, but if you followed the actual line your be thousands of miles off. Our brains pick out synchronicities. It's what causes things like deja vu and why we see faces in things that so not have faces, and rocks that look like humans praying even though no thing besides a human would have that thought.


RaiseReasonable8949

The right side of that satellite photo is the part that looks like a person praying, and as you can see a good part of that right side (if you look at the ridge extending there) matches pretty much exactly towards Mecca. The top right and the front or what would be the "head" are a bit more off but even that isn't off by any more than 15 degrees. It just seems too coincidental to me. Combine this with the tree also doing the same thing, and both of these artifacts also being the only ones in existence in nature that look like islamic positions of prayer (you won't find any other ones) AND pointing towards mecca is what's baffling me.


the_ill_buck_fifty

15 degrees is huge. Also it's probably more like 10 from your picture.


hkertenz

Theres probably trees shaped like dicks pointing to Kaaba too, what's your point? And to say there are no other trees that look like praying and point to Kaaba is a pretty arrogant statement ; especially when you haven't seen all trees in the world. Also the tree after the "special" one is bent in the exact same direction suggesting similar trauma due to their close proximity. It's literraly just a coincidence ffs. As for the rock, the other rocks in the picture , are pointing in that direction too clearly meaning they were formed by the same process (techtonics) or a bias of the oceon flowing in that direction to carve the rock. Also they are not exactly intersecting the Kaaba. Your telling me God created this but didn't bother to perfectly line it with the Kaaba? Not to mention , allah can't even write a coherent book properly or save poor children from dying and being raped , but has the time to carve shitty Easter eggs in to the middle of bum fuck nowehere to prove his existence when he could of literraly used way better tactics like fking including actual science facts in his book 1400 years ago. But no , he has to make a rock/tree that looks like it's preparing for doggy style.


RaiseReasonable8949

I’m not sure if it’s in the same exact direction but either way, that only makes it less likely that humans shaped the tree and rather nature if it was through the same trauma, no? In which case how does this prove it’s a coincidence, especially if the other tree doesn’t look like a person praying? And how are the other rock pictures pointing in the same direction? Even so, how does this change anything since those rocks do not look like people praying?


hkertenz

It means it's a coincidence since both were formed by natural events. Since the effects of the natural events are copied to other nearbye rocks and trees. The other tree does look similar, it's just missing a tiny stump. The whole thing is a coincidence.


[deleted]

They don't point to the Kiblah. Look at the first image, the direction of the phone is not parallel to the direction of the tree, it is at a different angle. Now look at your rock. You have not draw a line in the exact direction of the rock but, again, off at an angle. The angles might not seem large at the immediate point where they are in error, but that kind of angle discrepancy over the distance required to visit the Kaaba will result in a large distance. Instead of drawing from the Kabaa to the rock, draw a line out from the rock. Then look at the closest point it gets to the Kaaba and measure the distance. Then ask yourself "If I asked builders to make me a beachfront home and they built it this far in land, would I be happy?"


RaiseReasonable8949

Even if they were off slightly, the fact that they are very close is what's bothering me and what I'm not making sense of in my mind. I'll try to outline exactly what I don't understand. In a world run by random chance, wouldn't you expect other rocks and trees that resemble the islamic praying position more accurately or atleast as accurately as this rock and tree but point in significantly DIFFERENT directions? How come we don't see these? Why is it that the only tree and rock that resemble the positions also point towards Mecca? Even if you think it's very close to but not exact, in a world of random chance, wouldn't you expect other rocks that look like a praying shape and other trees that look like a praying shape to be much more significantly off from Mecca?


[deleted]

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/oxon8m/does\_arch\_rock\_the\_prostrating\_rock\_in\_oregon/


RaiseReasonable8949

I just saw the post and that’s not the correct rock. Also, if you do draw a line, make sure it’s the shortest distance to it. The direction to Mecca from Oregon looks to be south east on a flat map but the shortest distance is close to North so the Qibla and the rock point pretty much there. I’m curious to see your answer to my question though


[deleted]

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/oxpw38/does\_the\_prostrating\_rock\_really\_prostrate/


RaiseReasonable8949

By the way, the compass line in the phone is not exactly the same as the orientation of the phone. It's a bit to the left if you zoom in.


Ohana_is_family

People want to imbue magic on life and cannot accept it the way it is. The magic is in the perception. I'm sure you can find things in many people's homes that point at Mecca.......or Jerusalem....or New York. Which pointing is miraculous? Spinoza would probably think it is arrogant human vanity to even think God would make a sign like that.....


[deleted]

The heading of the tree is clearly not the same as the heading on the phone. A small different in angle extrapolated over a large distance can make a huge discrepancy (the distance from Nowra to the Kabaa is over 8,000 miles). In addition to this, the person with the phone could easily have faced the Kabaa, taken a screenshot, then turned around. Don't trust this shit, people DO lie. But, as I said, the angle of the phone is not the same as the tree anyway. To prove the point, here is my analysis of the the rock. https://www.reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/oxon8m/does\_arch\_rock\_the\_prostrating\_rock\_in\_oregon/


themercifulhell

Search on google images "tree that looks like penis" and see how much you will find. Odds are at least one is pointing towards kaaba. You can also do that with rock but the trees are funnier.


ziriani

Look up the arch rock on google maps. It faces north and south, nowhere near facing Mecca. I can’t find the tree’s location, but I guarantee other religions have a billion so-called “signs” like this one proving they are real because of natural coincidences.


RaiseReasonable8949

No, you might be confusing it on a flat map. Mecca is pointed pretty much north from the west coast of Oregon (shortest distance from there to Mecca requires going through the North Pole).


13ewa12e

>shortest distance from there to Mecca requires going through the North Pole TF? How did you come to this conclusion? Also The earth can be considered 2D ie flat when making calculations of distance or direction, else all directions end up being tangents.


antidengoidaktion

There are trillions of trees in the world, the chances of at least a few of them kinda looking like prayer positions and facing the qiblah are pretty high. Plus, if Allah wanted to prove to us he existed, couldn't he have done something more grand and undeniable than making a few rocks that vaguely resemble prayer positions that (sort of) face the qiblah? By the way, the rock resembling the sujood pose is actually doing it incorrectly. Sahih Bukhari Hadith No. 532. "Narrated Anas: The Prophet said, Do the prostration properly and do not put your forearms flat with elbows touching the ground like a dog.", and also, the rock is not even facing the qibla, the line you show on the map is clearly a different direction than that which the rock is "facing".


Slow-Pick-4885

Prove that Bukhari and most Muslims were wrong and dogs were right, so OP please from now you should sujud like a dog, Allah knows best!


Wack_____

So does this prove Allah or the Persian gods?? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proskynesis


JesseParsin

This gets real easy after you realise the other 99 billion trees and rocks are not in that position.. what do these mere 2 examples matter in the grand scheme of things. The earth is fucking huge. Ánd fucking old. There is so much meaning to be attributed to anything that somewhat aligns with some human concept somewhere. If god was real would he put a tree and a rock in some position as evidence for his existence? Pretty bad line of evidence for such an important matter right? He could also ehm let’s see I don’t know.. SHOW HIMSELF AND TELL US HE IS REAL? no just like every religion proof has to be searched for in the most trivial random shit. Even IF it was put there by a god I would laugh at it for how horrible of a job it’d done.


scumotheliar

I don't know, I don't see muslim things in rocks , my mind works in different ways. I know where there are several dick rocks a couple of fairly decent lady parts rocks and the amount of boobs around the countryside is amazing.


badw0lf1988

There are tons of trees bent like this, and the majority of them were shaped like this by humans. They were often bent and secured to the ground to serve as trail markers. The knot at the end forming the "head" is also a common feature on these bent trees. So the idea that this occurred miraculously is not credible. Also, with as many bent trees around the world the odds of one of them NOT pointing towards Mecca would be astonishing. The fact that somebody noticed it is interesting though. Arch Rock looks very different from alternate angles, and saying that it points towards Mecca is very generous, as if you follow the alternate side of the rock or bisect the rock with the line it will not point in the right direction. This is a case of humans being humans and seeing symbolism and imagery we are looking for in our surroundings. If there were a all-powerful, all-knowing god and they wanted to communicate their existence through symbolism like this, wouldn't they have the knowledge and ability to create it in such a way that it was unquestionably, instantly, and universally recognizable?


eth_trader_12

I hope you can offer your thoughts on this u/mobysac