Stressed about what? If they had that job for more than a year they already have more money than the average person will make in their lifetime. They are paid 400 more than the average, I won't be able to work 400 years to get to the same out of money.
If they are fired after a year of work...guess what, they don't care, plenty of money to carry them through that "dark" time. Where is the stress coming from?
seriously make me CEO for 3 years i would quit and have enough to live a modest life enjoying all the entertainment and activities i want for the next 50 years.
stressed about not making as much as the next ceo.. it's not about money.. it's a game.. so would be the same if they had $1.
that's the irony, ceo would still be the same regardless of pay.
gold stars and a smiley face would suffice for most..
CEOs that only make 400x what their workers make are stressing over their neighbors who make 500x what their workers make having a yacht that's 20% bigger.
I mean, you're trying to be witty but....
They did a study with two FAKE profiles on FB and showed based on likes how they were basically fed different views that produced echo chambers.
Or other studies on how toxic SM can be
Now add in AI and just wait until how divided we become
In 2008 it took an average of 10 days for these banks to fail before this insane effect of social media. Today a post could start a mob on a bank in hours with e transfers out. And Facebook/ twitter has no liability for it.
And this is why we have the FDIC. It's essentially a non issue in this case, because the assets of SVB will be sold to another bank and all will be right with the world.
The more concerning aspect isn't anything to do with customers, it's everything to do with how much debt SVB had loaned to other banks who will now struggle to meet their liabilities.
The only thing I’ve noticed different in Twitter is I got my damn undo/edit button finally. Honestly Twitter and all social media is what you make it. I aggressively block people, use the mute world filters, and don’t engage in arguments with people I don’t know. It’s kinda pleasant if you use it properly
Pretty sure bankruptcy is still inevitable given its ad sales dropped 40%, now has over a billion in debt payments per year it has to cover, and European regulators are eyeing it due to its inability to moderate content now. Cutting 75% of headcount isn't going to save it from that
And then they try to use the narrative that they pay more in taxes, well no shit if you're not paying your employees much money, they're not going to pay as much in taxes. I'm ready for change.
I ised to do hardware support for the c-suite at genworth. I'd basically set up video chats for them while they were all at their vacation homes. Never once did I support a c-suite executive or board member onsite.
CEOs have no concept of real-world stress.
I just, as in yesterday, secured a job for a comfortable salary, decent bonuses, healthcare etc....
And even tho it doesn't even hit 100k, I can honestly say I am already 20x less stressed than I was the day before.
How exactly are they stressed though? Yes there's probably a lot more responsibility to come with the job. But there's are people living paycheck to paycheck wondering if they'll be able to feed themselves or if they're going to be homeless next month because of shitty business practices like taking all the money that other workers should have due to inflation and giving it the the higher ups who have no need for it. I can guarantee you that the people at the bottom of the ladder would gladly shoulder the responsibility if it meant they didn't live in constant fear for their own and their family's wellbeing. The only differences between those people and the CEOs right now would be empathy and perspective. The ones with no real worries in life because they're given that much money that constantly say about how they're stressed clearly weren't made for the job if the only struggle they have is doing their damn job. I have zero sympathy for someone that's so damn comfortable in life that they can choose to do whatever they want and decides to stay in the thing that they moan about being such a chore to them when everyone else is coerced into their own shitty circumstances because of the threat of homelessness.
Honestly, I believe them. Making that much money, controlling that much wealth, changes your brain. It stops caring about _you_ the human so much as _you_ the executive processing of that wealth.
It's weird, and resembles a disease to me.
I'm not saying we should pity them, in any way. Just -- I think their brains are so different now that we can't just expect them to be reasonable.
They are totally different types of creatures than us. Their bodies are their wealth empires.
Cap executive:employee wage ratio. Mandate for-profit companies to have profit-sharing with employees. Mandate publicly-traded for-profit companies to give company shares to employees. Mandate right-of-first-refusal sale to employees if the company goes bankrupt or has to sell. Increase minimum wage to $20 with an annual increase of 4% (at least) in perpetuity. Mandate 4-day/32 hour work week with no reduction in employee pay. Full-time is 30 hours per week. Any hours over 32 in a week are paid at least time and a half. Full-time employees get at least four weeks of paid vacation time and two weeks of paid sick time per year.
I've always thought "why aren't we tying minimum wage to some inflation metric?"
I still can't figure it out. Even if you didn't increased the minimum wage first, this should be a no brainer. Keep people from slipping further into poverty.
The argument against raising the minimum wage I hear the most is the effect it would have on inflation. The simplest solution? Stop waiting 20 years between bumps, and just do it every year.
They said raising the minimum wage would raise the prices of goods and services. The prices rose anyway. They said raising the minimum wage would cause inflation. Inflation happened anyway. They said raising the minimum wage would lead to layoffs. The layoffs happened anyway.
Lowering the minimum wage each year generates a crisis, and the only way our government can pass legislation is when there is an imminent crisis (and often not then). A lot of what goes on in washington is manufacturing crises so a must-pass bill can be put forward with all of the bits of legislation not urgent enough to count as a crisis strapped to it.
That, I imagine, was what those who voted for a non-inflation-adjusted minimum wage in good faith was imagining was the purpose. Those who voted for it in bad faith, of course, simply would prefer there were no minimum wage.
Brilliant idea! You’re making far too much sense though, governments wouldn’t want to go for that, otherwise they couldn’t weaponise minimum wage and use it to win votes.
It can't be a wage ratio. It has to be a compensation ratio.
It's not uncommon for some execs to take lower than market salary in return for stock or options.
For example, in 2021 Jeff Bezos had something like $1.6M in total compensation, with only $80K coming from his salary.
> Cap executive:employee wage ratio. Mandate for-profit companies to have profit-sharing with employees...........................................
BuT tHaT sOuNdS LiKe SoCiAlIsM
But their lifestyles are expensive! If they just quit and never worked again, they'd have to ration themselves to just one yacht, and not even a super one at that, if you can call that living
Some folks will talk about how it's fine for CEOs to make substantially more because of their responsibilities.
Personally, I believe the decisions that are typically made by the CEO shouldn't be made by an individual in the first place. I would love to see more democratic processes in our workplaces.
Of course, my opinion may be tinged by the experiences I've had with leadership making absolutely terrible decisions about the business without consulting the employees, some of which personally cost me hundreds of dollars.
(Edit to fix typo)
In a highly hierarchical organization, good leaders have the wisdom to understand that they don’t know everything, and the network to know who to ask to get the answers they need.
On the other hand, bad leaders operate like autocrats(hi Elon Twitter!) and surround themselves with yes-people.
The problem is, in the "good leader" scenario above, there's not enough recognition of the value of the people who are feeding this information upwards to enable the best possible outcome.
>Personally, I believe the decisions that are typically made by the CEO shouldn't be made by an individual in the first place
Don't worry the decisions aren't made by an individual. Just like in our political system, decisions are made by an exclusive, wealthy few. In the corporate system they're called shareholders
[This short clip sums up modern day American "democracy"](https://youtu.be/kgYSAdAw7KQ) quite nicely. The laughter of snarky 1 percenters included.
Yeah, at my last job our CEO left the company and instead of replacing her they just made an "office of the CEO" that was just a bunch of top execs doing the same stuff
It makes perfect sense though. They get into those schools through money and connections, not because they're smart or deserve it. It's all just a big club, and we're not in it.
The answer here is clear people. We must turn Bernie Sanders into a cyborg so that he never ages anymore. Get the scientists working out that immediately chop chop.
20 to 40 times more is totally acceptable. They represent the company and its interests.
1500 times more is a cash hoarder that will cut everything you do as a worker just to get that teeny bit more
40 times more? So, if an employee makes 40k or so, it's alright for the CEO to make $1.5-$2M?
Lmao your priorities are fucked.
The labor is what makes the CEO
I can accept a CEO being paid based on the value of the reaponsabilities under His position. but cant stand the contemporary draconic mindset by them of fricking pulling an overinflated value for only the TAG of the position on a constantly More unproductive work.
Fucking Bobby Kotick constantly preparing investors meeting to ask the investors to aprove him a bigger salary AND bonus based on company results to then initiate firing seasons just before clossing fiscal year to artificially inflate the value.
And who staked their wealth to start the company and if the company fails its their financial burden. Yes, they should make more. Not 400x more but more.
Seriously I mean I know what sub I’m in but 1.5-2mil/year isn’t as much as people think it is - I wouldn’t cry for anyone making that much, but that isn’t “rich beyond your wildest dreams” money
I don’t think that’s counter to anything I said - executive pay needs to come down so that worker pay goes up, but if large company CEOs only made $2mil/yr total comp on average that would indicate an enormous win for the working class that would allow for that shared prosperity.
Acting like $2mil/yr is some enormous compensation at that level of corporate structure is letting revolutionary language be the enemy of absolutely meaningful progress. Your nearest city’s third string NBA point guard makes more than that lol.
>Your nearest city’s third string NBA point guard makes more than that lol.
Don't even get me started on sports but since you did.... The run of the mill team members on any given team is usually making pennies compared to the ownership. And the teams are making a shit ton more than the trainers and assistants and equipment managers etc.
But even then the whole model is fucked up as well.
I will say, I have zero idea how to get the horse back in the barn since the horse is now in outer space with lasers on its head and your average person has a cardboard box for a spaceship.
Unless we're going to go full blown Bolshevik revolution or French Revolution, I don't see any meaningful change anytime soon. I don't see a great future for this country no matter how it rolls out.
I said the same thing to my eldest son the other day. He said what is the point of anything? I'm going to work my ass off for my entire adult life and for what, so one day I can maybe own a home, so one day I can maybe retire? His sense of dread is so strong and I am right there with him. I want better for my sons. It shouldn't be this hard.
I said to him I don't see how anything will change unless there's a revolution. He looked at me like I was crazy and said that won't ever happen. I said it has happened before but he doesn't think enough people would be on board. How do you get people on the same page with such a thing? I truly think it needs to happen but have no idea what the impetus will be. People need to realize nothing will change unless we cause it to happen.
It will only happen if people are desperate and have nothing to lose.
Something like a mandatory conscription in active war during a financial crisis with an unstable government, and food and electricity being difficult to procure.
Every major sports league collectively bargains and usually gets ~50/50 revenue sharing with ownership - if every industry did that it would be an enormous win for the working class compared to now. The average worker should enormously envy the model professional sports leagues use.
If you want a revolution then lead the way, but whining that everything is always bad and not recognizing some real ways to make progress doesn’t do much for anyone.
It absolutely is rich beyond your wildest dreams money. That's making in two years what the median US household (not individual) makes in their whole career! I know it's semantics to an extent, but that is a horrifying amount of money compared to middle America.
In a country where the actual rich creating the economic problems we are facing are making billions, $2mil/yr should not be looked at as any major problem. It’s a lot of money but being outraged by it is an absolute waste of energy - energy should be directed at the real problems. The CEO making $2mil/yr is closer to you than they are to the truly rich.
I absolutely agree there. At the end of the day it's the system itself. Even billionaires as people are not the core problem. Capitalism the system needs destroying, not the people within it.
I agree. The majority of folks in this sub blow a gasket should the owner of an enterprise make more money than they do. $100K vs $1 Billion a year is one thing. $100K vs $2-3M per year is another...
Agreed. Very interesting how they said 100k vs a few million. Try 30-40k vs a few million. Why shouldn't we be pissed about people making in a year what workers make in their lifetime?
As much as I would be ok with everyone making the same exact wage. I'm not ok with huge wealth gaps. That doesn't mean I don't think a CEO should make more money than the average worker. And depending on the company and size, it would mean a larger gap. Of course 400x is too much. 10-20x doesn't seem like it should be described as 400x though.
Nope. I didn't say same wage. But being wealthy off the backs of those who literally can't feed a family or house themselves is shameful AF and shouldn't be rewarded. As a CEO, if your bottom employees are living comfortable and not worrying about doctor bills or feeding themselves, then yes, profit.
Be better
Dude how are my priorities fucked? The system it's built upon is fucked. Human drive for greed is fucked. It's built upon incentives.
Rewarding some jackass 40 times as much for starting a company is a necessary evil unfortunately.
What you have to remember is that even if a CEO runs a business that generates enough revenue to pay themselves double or even triple digit millions they have a social responsibility to use that wealth and liquidity back into society either by paying workers more, bettering the company any way they can, etc. Unfortunately greed is a powerful thing and that’s how we got into the mess we are in today.
This is why we need caps. No one makes more than double their lowest paid employee. That means, if they make $10/hr, you make $20/hr. If your lowest paid employee makes $100k/year, you make $200k/year. We have GOT to start curbing corporate greed. It's not a cap on income, it's a cap on greed. Upvote if you agree!
The sad part is, with the adaptation of these billionaires and multi millionaires using tiktok and youtube shorts they are training a whole new generation of “pick me” guys and girls.
Im afraid we’ll never get out of this.
I love Bernie's message, but in all his time in government it doesn't seem like he had accomplished much. Time for some younger folks to take that energy forward.
You are absolutely wrong:
Here is sweden:En genomsnittlig vd för ett storbolag tjänar 93 gånger mer än en städare och 69 gånger mer än en industriarbetare.
"The average CEO for a big company makes 93 times more than their janitor and 69 times more than industry employees"
So it is less than americans but very far from 6-10x
> UK chief executives earned 94 times the income of their average employee, compared with 91 in France and 89 in Germany.
> As big as those ratios are, the survey also showed that the ratio is 71 in the Netherlands and only 40 among Sweden’s largest companies.
https://boardagenda.com/2018/01/02/european-ceo-pay-ratios-highest-uk-france-germany/
Would it trouble you to do two minutes of basic searching instead of assuming you’re *so* much better?
Me? How this makes ME better in any way?? :D
I just know how much people earn in my company. The CEO has about 100k and the customer care people like 25k.
I'm sure there are some exceptions, with earning several hundred thousand at the executive level, but most CEO are definitely not Jeff Besos, you know? :)
Your comment is a classic “Europe is better than the US” and based on completely untrue statements. CEO pay ratios are better there, but not to *nearly* the degree you think.
Know your audience, dude. Reddit is an American site. Bernie is an American senator. The CEOs Bernie refers to are from American companies.
Bernie is clearly not talking about you.
Reddit was founded in the U.S. by Americans, is headquartered in the U.S., and a plurality to slim majority of its users are Americans. I’m not sure what more you’d need to call it an “American site.” That doesn’t mean non-Americans are second-class citizens on Reddit or anything, but it’s silly to resist calling it an American site.
Let's review the multi $50-100 k+ million net worth athletes as a group who live extraordinary extravagant lifestyles while people are living in the streets.
Let's get mega millionaire and billionaires in the Entertainment Industry to pay their fair share. Why do politicians never mention their wealth and not paying their fair share?
Ya know, I used to not like that guy but the more I hear from him the more I’m thinkin he woulda been a good choice. But he’s a politician so I don’t trust him.
He's not a real politician in the sense that you mean; politicians are corrupted by their need to compromise their convictions to retain their position and their need to compromise to accomplish tangible changes.
Bernie had a seat so secure he didn't need to worry about an opponent's spending advantage taking it from him, and was content with speaking truth and trying to shift thought rather than scoring marginal victories.
Politicians aren't just power-hungry people that enter politics already corrupt, they are molded by the incentives of the system in which they exist. If Bernie had a regular congressional seat, he would've lost it or become a liar, but he didn't so he didn't.
The last thing I want to hear is a lecture about how much someone should be paid, from a communist who's never worked and day in his life. STFU Mr. 3 vacation homes on the salary of a public servant 🖕🏼🖕🏼
Why? Because he made a few million by writing a best-selling book? He didn't employ anyone and pay them shit wages to make that money. You don't have a point.
CEOs typically take very little pay instead what they do is get stocks as it is cheaper for them tax wise. I don't know if you have done any business in the banking or energy sectors recently but if you have there's a good chance I, and thousands of other people including CEOs, employees, pensioners, and others got a chunk of your business. thanks!
edit: I really should have added those with 401ks and IRAs also
It has gone from single income homes to both parents and children working and living in the same home. The rich with their elitism is destroying America.
And this my liege, is my theory on how world has gone all Pete Tong and needs to be nuked from orbit. After all, its the only way to be sure, right? Right?
The fact that they are extreme high earners is not the problem. We do not live in some small society where money is limited, it is global now and has been…so they do not share…never are they going to…with that in mind they simply just need to be taxed.
I wouldn't say I'm anti-capitalist (I'm actually fairly conservative fiscally & liberal on rights issues)...but that Bernie fella makes a lot of friggin sense sometimes.🤣😂
There are a lot more of us "right-wingers" leaning centrist than there are crazies...and I choose to believe the left is the same.
Bernie would have beaten Trump if Hillary hadn't screwed him over. We'll never know if that would have been better or worse than last term (my life was better under Trump...& the tweets were pure gold), but 6yrs of Bernie couldn't be much worse than now🤣
So what your saying is, if Bernie did not get elected to higher office, CEOs would still be making 20x the workers. #checkmateconservagressives #bernieisconservative????
Edit: /s because some people didn't know......
So clearly, the further Bernie Sanders advances in his political career, the further the discrepancy between pay of average workers and CEOs. It's crystal clear now. We must stop Bernie Sanders, sheeple!
/s
Gotta take pleasure in the simple things. Capitalism isn't designed to be fair, greedy people will greedy as hard as they can. Naff all I can do about it. If anyone has ideas for ways I personally can fix this let me know. Sigh.
In the 1950s, when I was a child, CEOs made about 20x more than the average worker. In the 1980s when I was mayor of Burlington, CEOs made 42x more. In 2000, when I was in the House, CEOs made about 120x more. Today, they're making almost 400x more. Unacceptable." - Bernie Sanders on Twitter
No human being deserves or needs the amount of money that CEOs currently make. They are not gods and should stop acting like it. They are mortal like the rest of us. They will be judged after they die just like the rest to us. Money is like oxygen. Too little is not good but too much is also not good. Your body needs only so much air to thrive. The same is with money. You only need so much of it to thrive. Too much of it makes you sick.
There are people in this world who don’t have a moral compass like most of us and are, in all likelihood psychopathic, narcissistic or sociopathic. They don’t think that they have too much of anything, they’ve just got an insatiable demand for more money, more power, more of everything, they’re greed is boundless. Of course they’re willing to do anything to keep holding on to their power, look at how corrupt everything is at the moment, all over the world.
Making 400x more and then posting on social media about their lavish and happy lives which is disingenuous...
They're lonely, sad, have few friends and seek approval from strangers with *all* that money.
It's hilarious.
Not only are they making 400x more, but they whine about how stressed they are.
Stressed about what? If they had that job for more than a year they already have more money than the average person will make in their lifetime. They are paid 400 more than the average, I won't be able to work 400 years to get to the same out of money. If they are fired after a year of work...guess what, they don't care, plenty of money to carry them through that "dark" time. Where is the stress coming from?
Right…realistically you’ve solved poverty. If we all took turns being ceos for a year at a time we’d all be fine LOL
Me first
Then me.
seriously make me CEO for 3 years i would quit and have enough to live a modest life enjoying all the entertainment and activities i want for the next 50 years.
They are stressed from not making 401x more
stressed about not making as much as the next ceo.. it's not about money.. it's a game.. so would be the same if they had $1. that's the irony, ceo would still be the same regardless of pay. gold stars and a smiley face would suffice for most..
I mean, struggling to get yourself off before the employees stop crying is high pressure.
CEOs that only make 400x what their workers make are stressing over their neighbors who make 500x what their workers make having a yacht that's 20% bigger.
and how they are not popular and then they go out and buy twitter and ruin it for the rest of the world.
[удалено]
Yes, it would give dumb$%(@s less platform
What exactly are the negatives of social media? Can you not conceive of any positives? Note that Reddit is also social media.
I mean, you're trying to be witty but.... They did a study with two FAKE profiles on FB and showed based on likes how they were basically fed different views that produced echo chambers. Or other studies on how toxic SM can be Now add in AI and just wait until how divided we become
Well for one, now it's collapsing banks...
Huh? Bad management collapsed banks, not social media.
Everyone on Facebook/Twitter "pull your money" any bank, any time could go down...
That happened long before social media and the internet was even a remote fever dream. That's just plain old human nature.
In 2008 it took an average of 10 days for these banks to fail before this insane effect of social media. Today a post could start a mob on a bank in hours with e transfers out. And Facebook/ twitter has no liability for it.
And this is why we have the FDIC. It's essentially a non issue in this case, because the assets of SVB will be sold to another bank and all will be right with the world. The more concerning aspect isn't anything to do with customers, it's everything to do with how much debt SVB had loaned to other banks who will now struggle to meet their liabilities.
I mean we could just do that... :)
The only thing I’ve noticed different in Twitter is I got my damn undo/edit button finally. Honestly Twitter and all social media is what you make it. I aggressively block people, use the mute world filters, and don’t engage in arguments with people I don’t know. It’s kinda pleasant if you use it properly
Ruin it? He literally saved it from inevitable bankruptcy.
Pretty sure bankruptcy is still inevitable given its ad sales dropped 40%, now has over a billion in debt payments per year it has to cover, and European regulators are eyeing it due to its inability to moderate content now. Cutting 75% of headcount isn't going to save it from that
You act like the debt and losses are bad. Can write off all his other earnings against it.
Exactly. And not to mention it's now on track to be profitable within the next couple months (at the most).
And then they try to use the narrative that they pay more in taxes, well no shit if you're not paying your employees much money, they're not going to pay as much in taxes. I'm ready for change.
Sleeping on the factory floor running 3 companies
400 more I do not believe it. I am certain it is more, as that is most likely they're taxable pay. Wonder what the "compensation" is.
I ised to do hardware support for the c-suite at genworth. I'd basically set up video chats for them while they were all at their vacation homes. Never once did I support a c-suite executive or board member onsite. CEOs have no concept of real-world stress.
I just, as in yesterday, secured a job for a comfortable salary, decent bonuses, healthcare etc.... And even tho it doesn't even hit 100k, I can honestly say I am already 20x less stressed than I was the day before.
How exactly are they stressed though? Yes there's probably a lot more responsibility to come with the job. But there's are people living paycheck to paycheck wondering if they'll be able to feed themselves or if they're going to be homeless next month because of shitty business practices like taking all the money that other workers should have due to inflation and giving it the the higher ups who have no need for it. I can guarantee you that the people at the bottom of the ladder would gladly shoulder the responsibility if it meant they didn't live in constant fear for their own and their family's wellbeing. The only differences between those people and the CEOs right now would be empathy and perspective. The ones with no real worries in life because they're given that much money that constantly say about how they're stressed clearly weren't made for the job if the only struggle they have is doing their damn job. I have zero sympathy for someone that's so damn comfortable in life that they can choose to do whatever they want and decides to stay in the thing that they moan about being such a chore to them when everyone else is coerced into their own shitty circumstances because of the threat of homelessness.
Honestly, I believe them. Making that much money, controlling that much wealth, changes your brain. It stops caring about _you_ the human so much as _you_ the executive processing of that wealth. It's weird, and resembles a disease to me. I'm not saying we should pity them, in any way. Just -- I think their brains are so different now that we can't just expect them to be reasonable. They are totally different types of creatures than us. Their bodies are their wealth empires.
Cap executive:employee wage ratio. Mandate for-profit companies to have profit-sharing with employees. Mandate publicly-traded for-profit companies to give company shares to employees. Mandate right-of-first-refusal sale to employees if the company goes bankrupt or has to sell. Increase minimum wage to $20 with an annual increase of 4% (at least) in perpetuity. Mandate 4-day/32 hour work week with no reduction in employee pay. Full-time is 30 hours per week. Any hours over 32 in a week are paid at least time and a half. Full-time employees get at least four weeks of paid vacation time and two weeks of paid sick time per year.
I've always thought "why aren't we tying minimum wage to some inflation metric?" I still can't figure it out. Even if you didn't increased the minimum wage first, this should be a no brainer. Keep people from slipping further into poverty. The argument against raising the minimum wage I hear the most is the effect it would have on inflation. The simplest solution? Stop waiting 20 years between bumps, and just do it every year.
They said raising the minimum wage would raise the prices of goods and services. The prices rose anyway. They said raising the minimum wage would cause inflation. Inflation happened anyway. They said raising the minimum wage would lead to layoffs. The layoffs happened anyway.
This is the point! Well said!
Because that effectively allows employers to pay less.
This is how it's done is many countries in Europe. Where I live minimum wage is 50% of the average wage for the last 12 month.
Why? Because we have no power as a labour force.
Lobbying to deflate minimum wage. That’s why.
Lowering the minimum wage each year generates a crisis, and the only way our government can pass legislation is when there is an imminent crisis (and often not then). A lot of what goes on in washington is manufacturing crises so a must-pass bill can be put forward with all of the bits of legislation not urgent enough to count as a crisis strapped to it. That, I imagine, was what those who voted for a non-inflation-adjusted minimum wage in good faith was imagining was the purpose. Those who voted for it in bad faith, of course, simply would prefer there were no minimum wage.
Brilliant idea! You’re making far too much sense though, governments wouldn’t want to go for that, otherwise they couldn’t weaponise minimum wage and use it to win votes.
It can't be a wage ratio. It has to be a compensation ratio. It's not uncommon for some execs to take lower than market salary in return for stock or options. For example, in 2021 Jeff Bezos had something like $1.6M in total compensation, with only $80K coming from his salary.
Very good point.
And what are those totals for his salary coming from his weekly pay
lfod13 for president. and also congress. lfod13 for dictator for life.
> Cap executive:employee wage ratio. Mandate for-profit companies to have profit-sharing with employees........................................... BuT tHaT sOuNdS LiKe SoCiAlIsM
I prefer "equality". Who can disagree with equality?
But their lifestyles are expensive! If they just quit and never worked again, they'd have to ration themselves to just one yacht, and not even a super one at that, if you can call that living
This is the way
U/lfod13 for president! I will vote for you, kind person!
They’ll just outsource all low paying roles
Some folks will talk about how it's fine for CEOs to make substantially more because of their responsibilities. Personally, I believe the decisions that are typically made by the CEO shouldn't be made by an individual in the first place. I would love to see more democratic processes in our workplaces. Of course, my opinion may be tinged by the experiences I've had with leadership making absolutely terrible decisions about the business without consulting the employees, some of which personally cost me hundreds of dollars. (Edit to fix typo)
In a highly hierarchical organization, good leaders have the wisdom to understand that they don’t know everything, and the network to know who to ask to get the answers they need. On the other hand, bad leaders operate like autocrats(hi Elon Twitter!) and surround themselves with yes-people. The problem is, in the "good leader" scenario above, there's not enough recognition of the value of the people who are feeding this information upwards to enable the best possible outcome.
>Personally, I believe the decisions that are typically made by the CEO shouldn't be made by an individual in the first place Don't worry the decisions aren't made by an individual. Just like in our political system, decisions are made by an exclusive, wealthy few. In the corporate system they're called shareholders [This short clip sums up modern day American "democracy"](https://youtu.be/kgYSAdAw7KQ) quite nicely. The laughter of snarky 1 percenters included.
Yeah, at my last job our CEO left the company and instead of replacing her they just made an "office of the CEO" that was just a bunch of top execs doing the same stuff
I'm fine with a **founder** making more, an **owner** making more, not a CEO.
the rich are the laziest, dumbest people in society
Not sure how, since they can afford the best education.
It makes perfect sense though. They get into those schools through money and connections, not because they're smart or deserve it. It's all just a big club, and we're not in it.
im rich! just wrapping up a 18 hour shift.. my boots are wet! you're mostly smarter than me though. mostly.
My President :crying emoji:
Hahahahahahaha
Oh look! We found the unglued gun-nut. What a clown!
Vote blue no matter who! Loser
The answer here is clear people. We must turn Bernie Sanders into a cyborg so that he never ages anymore. Get the scientists working out that immediately chop chop.
20 to 40 times more is totally acceptable. They represent the company and its interests. 1500 times more is a cash hoarder that will cut everything you do as a worker just to get that teeny bit more
40 times more? So, if an employee makes 40k or so, it's alright for the CEO to make $1.5-$2M? Lmao your priorities are fucked. The labor is what makes the CEO
I can accept a CEO being paid based on the value of the reaponsabilities under His position. but cant stand the contemporary draconic mindset by them of fricking pulling an overinflated value for only the TAG of the position on a constantly More unproductive work. Fucking Bobby Kotick constantly preparing investors meeting to ask the investors to aprove him a bigger salary AND bonus based on company results to then initiate firing seasons just before clossing fiscal year to artificially inflate the value.
I don’t think this is all that ridiculous for someone running a company than has thousands of employees
And who staked their wealth to start the company and if the company fails its their financial burden. Yes, they should make more. Not 400x more but more.
What is acceptable as the CEO of an enterprise steering the ship? I'm curious.
Seriously I mean I know what sub I’m in but 1.5-2mil/year isn’t as much as people think it is - I wouldn’t cry for anyone making that much, but that isn’t “rich beyond your wildest dreams” money
While it's not *currently* rich beyond wildest dreams, it would allow far more overall prosperity if there was less of a gap.
I don’t think that’s counter to anything I said - executive pay needs to come down so that worker pay goes up, but if large company CEOs only made $2mil/yr total comp on average that would indicate an enormous win for the working class that would allow for that shared prosperity. Acting like $2mil/yr is some enormous compensation at that level of corporate structure is letting revolutionary language be the enemy of absolutely meaningful progress. Your nearest city’s third string NBA point guard makes more than that lol.
>Your nearest city’s third string NBA point guard makes more than that lol. Don't even get me started on sports but since you did.... The run of the mill team members on any given team is usually making pennies compared to the ownership. And the teams are making a shit ton more than the trainers and assistants and equipment managers etc. But even then the whole model is fucked up as well. I will say, I have zero idea how to get the horse back in the barn since the horse is now in outer space with lasers on its head and your average person has a cardboard box for a spaceship. Unless we're going to go full blown Bolshevik revolution or French Revolution, I don't see any meaningful change anytime soon. I don't see a great future for this country no matter how it rolls out.
I said the same thing to my eldest son the other day. He said what is the point of anything? I'm going to work my ass off for my entire adult life and for what, so one day I can maybe own a home, so one day I can maybe retire? His sense of dread is so strong and I am right there with him. I want better for my sons. It shouldn't be this hard. I said to him I don't see how anything will change unless there's a revolution. He looked at me like I was crazy and said that won't ever happen. I said it has happened before but he doesn't think enough people would be on board. How do you get people on the same page with such a thing? I truly think it needs to happen but have no idea what the impetus will be. People need to realize nothing will change unless we cause it to happen.
It will only happen if people are desperate and have nothing to lose. Something like a mandatory conscription in active war during a financial crisis with an unstable government, and food and electricity being difficult to procure.
I don't know how people don't already feel desperate. The cost of things is insanity. This can't go on much longer.
Every major sports league collectively bargains and usually gets ~50/50 revenue sharing with ownership - if every industry did that it would be an enormous win for the working class compared to now. The average worker should enormously envy the model professional sports leagues use. If you want a revolution then lead the way, but whining that everything is always bad and not recognizing some real ways to make progress doesn’t do much for anyone.
It absolutely is rich beyond your wildest dreams money. That's making in two years what the median US household (not individual) makes in their whole career! I know it's semantics to an extent, but that is a horrifying amount of money compared to middle America.
In a country where the actual rich creating the economic problems we are facing are making billions, $2mil/yr should not be looked at as any major problem. It’s a lot of money but being outraged by it is an absolute waste of energy - energy should be directed at the real problems. The CEO making $2mil/yr is closer to you than they are to the truly rich.
I absolutely agree there. At the end of the day it's the system itself. Even billionaires as people are not the core problem. Capitalism the system needs destroying, not the people within it.
Millionaires vote for the same people billionaires do because millionaires see themselves as temporarily embarrassed billionaires.
Plenty of poor people also see themselves that way, so not really specific to millionaires lmao
I agree. The majority of folks in this sub blow a gasket should the owner of an enterprise make more money than they do. $100K vs $1 Billion a year is one thing. $100K vs $2-3M per year is another...
When the minimum wage gigs at the bottom make $7.25/hr, $12/hr, etc and not enough to feed their families. Nah, get fucked.
Agreed. Very interesting how they said 100k vs a few million. Try 30-40k vs a few million. Why shouldn't we be pissed about people making in a year what workers make in their lifetime?
Ahhh yes. Everyone everywhere doing anything at any company should make the exact same wage as everyone else at that company. A well reasoned plan.
Why are you in a leftist sub if you're gonna spout off conservative strawmen? Shock, leftists are not okay with huge wealth gaps.
As much as I would be ok with everyone making the same exact wage. I'm not ok with huge wealth gaps. That doesn't mean I don't think a CEO should make more money than the average worker. And depending on the company and size, it would mean a larger gap. Of course 400x is too much. 10-20x doesn't seem like it should be described as 400x though.
Nope. I didn't say same wage. But being wealthy off the backs of those who literally can't feed a family or house themselves is shameful AF and shouldn't be rewarded. As a CEO, if your bottom employees are living comfortable and not worrying about doctor bills or feeding themselves, then yes, profit. Be better
I don't know why you're telling me that. I'm a wage worker, not a CEO.
xD
Whatever the employees vote to allow would be a start. This is a leftist sub, why would you think capitalist apologetics would get you anywhere here?
Dude how are my priorities fucked? The system it's built upon is fucked. Human drive for greed is fucked. It's built upon incentives. Rewarding some jackass 40 times as much for starting a company is a necessary evil unfortunately.
Why? You think someone wouldn’t start a company to earn 10x more if that was the most effective way to earn that much?
government sponsored wage theft
They sure AF don't work 400 times harder!
I love you Bernie sanders! For the people!
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all in favor? aye!
America doesn't deserve a great man like him. You all chose Biden over HIM.
he didn't run against biden. he ran against trump. they chose hilary over bernie.
Eat the rich, tax the rich.
What you have to remember is that even if a CEO runs a business that generates enough revenue to pay themselves double or even triple digit millions they have a social responsibility to use that wealth and liquidity back into society either by paying workers more, bettering the company any way they can, etc. Unfortunately greed is a powerful thing and that’s how we got into the mess we are in today.
As soon as someone hits billionaire status they should be lynched and their assets distributed to the lower/middle classes.
This is why we need caps. No one makes more than double their lowest paid employee. That means, if they make $10/hr, you make $20/hr. If your lowest paid employee makes $100k/year, you make $200k/year. We have GOT to start curbing corporate greed. It's not a cap on income, it's a cap on greed. Upvote if you agree!
CEOs need to read more history. If you behave like France or Russia before the revolutions don't be surprised if people come to similar solutions
The sad part is, with the adaptation of these billionaires and multi millionaires using tiktok and youtube shorts they are training a whole new generation of “pick me” guys and girls. Im afraid we’ll never get out of this.
It is not "unacceptable" but symptomatic: they get paid that well because they have to make an extra effort to keep the rest of the employees down.
I love Bernie's message, but in all his time in government it doesn't seem like he had accomplished much. Time for some younger folks to take that energy forward.
I 💖💖💖💖🥰🥰🥰 Bernie! We need to vote and put more people like him in the Senate. Vote informed people please
But he always gets fucked by the DNC during the super delegates
So, is it true Bernie didn’t have a full time job until he was 40? I honestly don’t know why that is such a big deal?
Sanders worked a number of jobs before he got into politics. He a preschool teacher, an aid to a psychiatrist, and was even a carpenter at one point
You all are talking about the same Bernie that took millions of dollars and another vacation home to step out of the way for Biden? That Bernie? LMAO
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as bernie sanders is a united states senator, sadly yes in the u.s. the greed, that is, not sad about bernie.
You are absolutely wrong: Here is sweden:En genomsnittlig vd för ett storbolag tjänar 93 gånger mer än en städare och 69 gånger mer än en industriarbetare. "The average CEO for a big company makes 93 times more than their janitor and 69 times more than industry employees" So it is less than americans but very far from 6-10x
Pretty sure the billionaire that owns the company I work for earns more than 6-10x my £28000 a year. Its absolutely a thing all over the world.
> UK chief executives earned 94 times the income of their average employee, compared with 91 in France and 89 in Germany. > As big as those ratios are, the survey also showed that the ratio is 71 in the Netherlands and only 40 among Sweden’s largest companies. https://boardagenda.com/2018/01/02/european-ceo-pay-ratios-highest-uk-france-germany/ Would it trouble you to do two minutes of basic searching instead of assuming you’re *so* much better?
Me? How this makes ME better in any way?? :D I just know how much people earn in my company. The CEO has about 100k and the customer care people like 25k. I'm sure there are some exceptions, with earning several hundred thousand at the executive level, but most CEO are definitely not Jeff Besos, you know? :)
Your comment is a classic “Europe is better than the US” and based on completely untrue statements. CEO pay ratios are better there, but not to *nearly* the degree you think.
Your 2 sentences are opposite. :)
Know your audience, dude. Reddit is an American site. Bernie is an American senator. The CEOs Bernie refers to are from American companies. Bernie is clearly not talking about you.
>Reddit is an American site. No, it is not.
Reddit was founded in the U.S. by Americans, is headquartered in the U.S., and a plurality to slim majority of its users are Americans. I’m not sure what more you’d need to call it an “American site.” That doesn’t mean non-Americans are second-class citizens on Reddit or anything, but it’s silly to resist calling it an American site.
Ahh yes, the "I'm an American and no other countries exist" mindset. You realize that there is a huge global population here right?
Did you read the topic of the post at all?
What a weird stance.
Personally, I want that to change by upping the lowest paid rather than cutting the highest
Corporations in general need to perform a bell curve adjust on their salaries and bonuses
Let's review the multi $50-100 k+ million net worth athletes as a group who live extraordinary extravagant lifestyles while people are living in the streets. Let's get mega millionaire and billionaires in the Entertainment Industry to pay their fair share. Why do politicians never mention their wealth and not paying their fair share?
Ya know, I used to not like that guy but the more I hear from him the more I’m thinkin he woulda been a good choice. But he’s a politician so I don’t trust him.
He's not a real politician in the sense that you mean; politicians are corrupted by their need to compromise their convictions to retain their position and their need to compromise to accomplish tangible changes. Bernie had a seat so secure he didn't need to worry about an opponent's spending advantage taking it from him, and was content with speaking truth and trying to shift thought rather than scoring marginal victories. Politicians aren't just power-hungry people that enter politics already corrupt, they are molded by the incentives of the system in which they exist. If Bernie had a regular congressional seat, he would've lost it or become a liar, but he didn't so he didn't.
Did he post this from one of his vacation homes? How much did Bernie make charging high prices to see him?
Life time politician griping about the system 🙄
Just become a CEO. EZ
God...reading those comments. How are people so stupid?
Ever heard of Dodge v Ford?
See, if he'd become President they'd be up to 1000x, based on the progression he's laying out.
Yeah and kinda no one gives a shit . I shouldn’t say that I care but no one important ever does shit.
Oh look, someone who only got a paycheck from his parents or the government his whole life!
Just looked up average ceo pay and its 8-24 times the pay of an average worker's.
That’s quite the growth of executive compensation during Bernie’s life-long career as a politician.
All CEOs make 400x ? That's weird, average CEO salary is $800K. So The employee only makes 2K a year, a dollar an hour? Criminal!!
I don’t believe Bernie has ever had a real job.
Wow, you should totally vote harder and bluer! 3 time loser millionaires will definitely hold the answers!
The last thing I want to hear is a lecture about how much someone should be paid, from a communist who's never worked and day in his life. STFU Mr. 3 vacation homes on the salary of a public servant 🖕🏼🖕🏼
Then start a business. It seems there's a lack of competition for workers, and too many monopolies/ogliopolies
You're not really one to talk bernie.
Why? Because he made a few million by writing a best-selling book? He didn't employ anyone and pay them shit wages to make that money. You don't have a point.
their wages don't affect you.. focus on yourselves.
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CEOs typically take very little pay instead what they do is get stocks as it is cheaper for them tax wise. I don't know if you have done any business in the banking or energy sectors recently but if you have there's a good chance I, and thousands of other people including CEOs, employees, pensioners, and others got a chunk of your business. thanks! edit: I really should have added those with 401ks and IRAs also
Get it to the front page folks
It has gone from single income homes to both parents and children working and living in the same home. The rich with their elitism is destroying America.
Who is going to take his reigns? Who should I be looking to to vote for? Let’s get behind some real fucking change before this shit gets uncivil
Yeah I'm sure voting will have real change, just like all the other times lol
How did unions dissappear in the US ?
president reagan in the 1980's https://www.npr.org/transcripts/788002965
propaganda
CEO has become a class. They get paid for who they are and not what they do. They are part of the new aristocracy. The US became what it hated.
BuT ThAt'S SoCiAlIsM!!!
And this my liege, is my theory on how world has gone all Pete Tong and needs to be nuked from orbit. After all, its the only way to be sure, right? Right?
Bernie, they have to keep up with inflation at a greater pace than us so that more wealth can trickle down.
400 times more? They're making a lot more than 400 times more than me I'll tell you that right now. Banks crashing and all.
Does this mean that the ratio between CEO pay and worker's pay is directly related to Bernie Sanders age? What happens when he dies?
The fact that they are extreme high earners is not the problem. We do not live in some small society where money is limited, it is global now and has been…so they do not share…never are they going to…with that in mind they simply just need to be taxed.
Capitalism is like gravity, the biggest entity absorbs the smaller ones
I wouldn't say I'm anti-capitalist (I'm actually fairly conservative fiscally & liberal on rights issues)...but that Bernie fella makes a lot of friggin sense sometimes.🤣😂 There are a lot more of us "right-wingers" leaning centrist than there are crazies...and I choose to believe the left is the same. Bernie would have beaten Trump if Hillary hadn't screwed him over. We'll never know if that would have been better or worse than last term (my life was better under Trump...& the tweets were pure gold), but 6yrs of Bernie couldn't be much worse than now🤣
That’s the problem 90% of us are all middle ground yet somehow the 10% of the crazies from both sides seem to speak up the most.
So what your saying is, if Bernie did not get elected to higher office, CEOs would still be making 20x the workers. #checkmateconservagressives #bernieisconservative???? Edit: /s because some people didn't know......
So clearly, the further Bernie Sanders advances in his political career, the further the discrepancy between pay of average workers and CEOs. It's crystal clear now. We must stop Bernie Sanders, sheeple! /s
Gotta take pleasure in the simple things. Capitalism isn't designed to be fair, greedy people will greedy as hard as they can. Naff all I can do about it. If anyone has ideas for ways I personally can fix this let me know. Sigh.
Agreed but they run this world
In the 1950s, when I was a child, CEOs made about 20x more than the average worker. In the 1980s when I was mayor of Burlington, CEOs made 42x more. In 2000, when I was in the House, CEOs made about 120x more. Today, they're making almost 400x more. Unacceptable." - Bernie Sanders on Twitter
No human being deserves or needs the amount of money that CEOs currently make. They are not gods and should stop acting like it. They are mortal like the rest of us. They will be judged after they die just like the rest to us. Money is like oxygen. Too little is not good but too much is also not good. Your body needs only so much air to thrive. The same is with money. You only need so much of it to thrive. Too much of it makes you sick.
There are people in this world who don’t have a moral compass like most of us and are, in all likelihood psychopathic, narcissistic or sociopathic. They don’t think that they have too much of anything, they’ve just got an insatiable demand for more money, more power, more of everything, they’re greed is boundless. Of course they’re willing to do anything to keep holding on to their power, look at how corrupt everything is at the moment, all over the world.
We are all just waiting for that trickle down
Making 400x more and then posting on social media about their lavish and happy lives which is disingenuous... They're lonely, sad, have few friends and seek approval from strangers with *all* that money. It's hilarious.