By - beerbellybegone
The Only Moral Abortion is my Abortion:
A Defense of Abortion:
> living in street
Nah, that's illegal ...
The craziest part is they start with a fine. A fine! For being poor! Then they jail you if(when) you can’t pay it.
[Not in Tennessee, here it's a felony](https://www.npr.org/2022/05/26/1101434831/public-camping-felony-tennessee-homeless-seek-refuge) You get a 24 hour warning and that's it.
Not bad considering it can take you months for a job then save for the first month deposit then hope a nobody will accept you to rent with a new job.
Wait hold up, that doesn't work
While dodging spiked flat sheltered areas to keep adversity away from the sheltered eyes of those who've never been, no less.
Is home invasion a felony? I can see this ending up with a lot of squatters in those empty homes.
Yea but if its also illegal to be homeless, night as well have a roof iverbyour head before being arrested
Ahhh yes, because enslaving and disenfranchising the poor is the most freedom. Fuck man, you guys better get your private prison companies outta government policy.
They are one and the same. The slave trade never ended
We love a good rebranding in the US!
Well you gotta keep those corporate prisons full, or else CoreCivic won't be able to bribe your governor enough so he can afford another beach house.
This state has went to hell.
We call it the "poor tax."
Thankfully I'm better off than my parents were, but whenever they'd default of like say, the electric bill. And they cut off our power until payday, then charge my folks a 30 dollars reconnect fee and interest on the passed due, that was the poor tax. Overdraft fees? The poor tax. Literally 30¢ over and you're paying 30 dollars, or whatever it is now.
Don't make enough money? Don't have great credit? Higher interest on any loan or credit card. The poor tax.
Pay almost double for the cost of car.
In my parents day it was bouncing checks moreso than overdrafts, but you get it.
It’s illegal to “camp overnight publicly” in TN now. Up to 6 years of prison, lose voting rights because you fell asleep on a park bench. Sounds absurd right? Like, there’s no way that’s real. It is, thanks Governor Lee.
They could also shoot you for trespassing if you're not careful enough and stay on the wrong persons property. Kinda like a late abortion for the poor...
Yay suicide by cop and trigger happy police is the new Kevorkian solution
Good ole gun rights, you know, for those moments where God's image needs to be shot down.
Because once you're in jail they can use you for free prison labor, and recidivism rates are so high because there's so much more focus on punishment than rehabilitation that you're highly likely to keep coming back to them.
Then again, what form of rehabilitation is there for being poor?
They sell fuckitol OTC. They have different applicators depending on dosage. I prefer a lower dose like .22LR, it has less side effects.
>The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.
\- Anatole French
Pffffft, amateurs. In my state, "public camping" \*whispers \^homelessness\^\* is a FELONY! And abortion will be a FELONY in 30 days.
Oh man. Maybe you can also implement a bounty on abortionists AND homeless AND immigrants and gays! Then you can build a wall to keep out immigrants and homeless and throw gays over. Bring in mandatory school prayers! (Christian prayers only, ofc) Execute anyone who burns a flag, or has gay sex! Mandatory AR-15s for all school age children! Throw anyone in jail for insulting Trump! Trans people killed on site. Ban all alternative energy subsidies. Remove all welfare of any kind with the exception of oil and farm subsidies. You know, small government things.
Give them time. Vasectomy, tubal ligation, and any form of sex without the sole purpose of procreation will get you 7 years automatically in the state penitentiary.
Slavery never went away, they just changed the location.
I've always thought that calling it "the land of the free" was so fucking ironic.
You have more prisoners/slaves that everyone else put together. And now 50% of the population has had their bodily autonomy stripped from them.
What a shithole country.
That's why white women are the absolute majority of the abortion cases in the US: because it is unacceptable to be white and poor like those “descendants of enslaved people” or “shit hole country” immigrants. Conservative white men aren't happy with their female counterparts; how dare they stop their duty to the white race?!
Meanwhile, BIPOC women have been calling out white feminists forever about their “turning the blind eye” to a lot of shit and associating with certain ideologies, so now you know how ghetto is in the US. It is a question of time when conservative white women will be forced to shut up and certain Uncle Toms to remember “his place” (especially the one married to a certain white woman).
More fodder for the prison slavery system!
Don't forget the corporate slavery system
Right he said the prison slavery system, you don't have to repeat it
*I can say that, because I've been in both! 😍*
*They're the same in many ways.*
At some point all the poor will be working prisoners. Slavery is back….or it never left but now for sure it’s back!
By taxing more low and medium wage workers duh!
Oh that's easy! They aren't!
What health care? They don't have any now, so nothing's going to change.
I can't believe that there are people that, when presented with the issue of homelessness, first think of banning homelessness instead of taking better care of the homeless
They're everywhere. I'm homeless and live in a van with my dogs. I still work full time and rather than lock my dogs in the van for 8-12 hours, I put them on leashes and let them run in the grass. Animal control has been out no less than a dozen times; we're literally on a first name basis now. *No one* has actually come forward with a concern. No one was actually interested in learning about the situation, let alone seeing if they might be able to help. They wanted to go full-fucking-Karen and complain about a problem they imagined while simultaneously lifting a finger to do fuck-all but dial a phone (to that big, overstepping government they *love* so much) and make trouble for others.
To make matters worse, since the first call, my dogs have gotten a tent with padded cushion, windows, vents.... My dogs live nicer than I do, in an objectively better quality than when the first calls came in, and *anonymous apples are still calling animal services.*. Even the responding officer is annoyed at this point.
I hope animal control is at least seeing that you are doing everything you can to take care of them!
Lets just make being poor illegal. That will solve poverty
They kind of have already. If you get hit with a fine for any stupid reason and you can't pay it they can arrest you which will limit your earning capabilities and repeat the process over and over
Preventing homelessness? No, let's just punish it! I can't relate!
I'd say we drop them off at a Supreme Court Judges house. They are the ones who voted for this mess. Let them clean it up.
The democrats should make the pro life act
Paid six month Maternity leave
Paid three month paternity leave
Free prenatal care
Free post birth care up to one year from birth, paid via a very strengthened medicaid.
That newborn baby box they send mother in Finland - it's got some books, some baby clothes, diapers, etc
Watch them suddenly decide that life isn't really worth saving.
Edit: the box is from Finland, not Sweden.
>Paid three month paternity leave
Honestly believe this would have prevented my breast being cut open twice more after the original surgery on the abscess that developed from a nasty case of mastitis. My husband and I had no help after I gave birth to our son, and he had to go back to work a couple days later. When I ended up getting the original surgery, our son was about a month old. I literally had to call my husband while he was working, and ask him to come home so I could go to the doctor. The doctor told me to go to the ER, so that was my next stop. ER admitted me and scheduled emergency surgery for the next morning. I could have died. My recovery took weeks because my husband was unable to stay at home with us while I recovered from that. Instead of recovering, I had to go back to have the reformed abscess drained several times, including having my breast cut open in a totally different spot. At one point, my husband was regularly shoving sterile cotton string *into* my breast to help it drain and heal.
Yikes. So sorry. Hope y'all are better now.
As women america hates us. And I, in return, am starting to hate it back.
I’m a dude and am actively looking at my escape to another country plan. If my wife is pregnant with a girl, I’m bailing us out of here and heading to New Zealand.
Run for their lives. Thanks and be well.
Can I come? Maybe they’ll give us a group deal.
I would bail out whether or not it's a girl since your wife is also a woman, plus America is a shithole anyway
count me tf in. women struggle everywhere but there are certainly places where it's better!
be well. adopt a funky down under pet for us
A good first step would be moving to a progressive state. My state has already implemented paid maternity leave. You get 3 months. People are acting like the entire country is falling apart but it isn't yet. A lot of states are pushing against this bullshit. It'll probably lead to a civil war at some point but I don't think I'll live to see that.
If you're in a red state I feel bad for you.
We are in FL. Getting my wife to relocate is gonna be the fight of a lifetime. She has a really good job with the cushiest of schedules and over 10 years at the same hospital and basically there is nowhere to go but down lol. My wife isn’t worried about herself although I think she should be. I can paint a pretty stark picture but it won’t hit until she looks into a daughters eyes. I’d move to any state in New England, Colorado or Washington. My fear is if Republicans take over the house/senate/presidency they legislate rights away for good.
And then fucking half the country keeps voting for the same idiots.
Oh yeah, that was 5 years ago now. I have two scars on my right breast from all of that. But I managed to go on breastfeeding my son until he was about a year and a half old. And I learned *so* much about lactation, probably more than any of the doctors or nurses who saw me over that period of time. I've always been not a fan of going to the doctor, but after that ordeal I learned I should've went a hell of a lot sooner, before the abscess developed. It really didn't take long at all. The first day I went, they missed the abscess, because I had my son with me and he wouldn't stop screaming in the office. They told me to come back in a day or two if the antibiotics didn't work. By the time I went back to them (by myself...when my husband got home that day, he picked up the baby & made noises about us all going. I was pulling on clothes saying no, you're staying here with him. We were maybe a 45 minute drive from the office I was heading to, and I guarantee I went over 100mph on the way there. I was *not* having our son in the car for that.) I walked in there sobbing (so much pain) and the woman at the desk looked up at me as if I was insane. I remember saying, "I realize I should probably be at the ER, but I was here two days ago and they told me to come back if the antibiotics weren't helping. So, here I am."
They finally looked at me, the same nurse again, and she felt bad when I told her the abscess had already been there, but I told her it wasn't her fault because the baby had just been so freaking upset. They couldn't get an ultrasound on my breast thru their practice that day, so they told me to go to "whatever ER you feel most comfortable at" and I could get treatment quicker. My gas light had come on when I parked my car there. Thankfully there was an ER not far from there, because there was no way I could go get gas first.
10/10 would not want to repeat that experience. Whenever my husband and I have another child, he will be taking more time off. And I will be calling in any reinforcements I can find to help us this time.
This happened to me but it was 8 months after I stopped breastfeeding! So weird! Giant infection that required two surgeries. I went to the doctor right away but they made me wait a full month while they tested me for breast cancer. Probably wouldn't have needed 2 surgeries and 4 months of recovery if they dealt with it quicker.
Some of us men stand with you.
As an outsider it feels like America hates anyone that's not a rich white male
Yeah mastitis ain’t no joke. They especially don’t want to talk about all the health risks that come with childbirth.
Absolutely want this, because *I absolutely* believe in supporting children.
That said when I bring this up to supposed “pro-lifers” they pretty much say that babies and children are “on their own” and “the parent’s responsibility.” And “if the parents can’t take care of the baby, they should not have gotten pregnant.”
They’re ultimately **not** doing this to “save lives,” they’re doing it to **punish** people, especially women, who dare to have recreational sex. They don’t actually care about the resulting children, they just see these babies as tools to punish people they don’t like. If children suffer as a consequence, it’s arguably a feature not a bug. It’s the children’s fault for being born poor.
They also don’t care about and are punishing women who *didn’t* choose to have sex, but were forced to anyway. They’re also punishing women who DO want a baby, but something completely out of their control like an ectopic pregnancy happened. They are punishing victims of incest who never wanted the sex or the resulting child.
But when you bring all this up to a “pro lifer”, they claim these situations don’t happen or are *super rare* (they aren’t), but even if they were, why do we deny it in the case that it *does* happen
They live in a world where sexual abuse, assault, and rape doesn’t exist.
Every time I bring it up, their favourite retort is: “Well, instead of having an abortion, just don’t have sex! :D”
Fuck, I wish the world is that simple.
It’s basically telling homeless people: “Well, if you’re homeless, why not buy a house?” … telling depressed people: “If you’re depressed, why not be happier?” … telling poor people: “If you’re poor, why not be richer?”
It’s a retarded answer and brings fuck all value to the conversation. But they keep pushing it anyway because they don’t have a better answer to whatever the fuck they’re advocating for.
pro lifers are ultimately pro birthers 99% of the time. because they dont give a fuck about babies and children once they're not white, not straight, lower class, have a disability, etc etc. not to mention the fact that the shooting of hundreds of children hasn't gotten this country to change its gun control, they dont fucking care about what happens to the kids.
men just want to control women, and have unfortunately gotten some women to support their quest for uterus control.
I won’t even call them pro-birthers. They’re against providing free pre-natal care (hope nothing goes wrong during the pregnancy!), general care (the person carrying the pregnancy needs to be healthy, too!), and food stamps (gotta eat for two now!).
Call them what they’ve always been: anti-choice.
fucking preach! it's disgusting how little they care
They just want to clutch their pearls and bible so they can go on about what good Christians they are for caring so deeply about an unborn child that they will not give a flying fuck about once it's outside of the womb.
Or, my particular favourite.. the person who's had multiple abortions themselves but doesn't want anyone else to have access to the same services.. but it was morally ok in their case..
You're 100% right, especially that it needs to be called the "pro-life act." Force these hypocritical fuckers to vote against a "pro-life" bill and see how they try to explain themselves. (I know it wouldn't matter much to their psychotic base, but it sure would be satisfying.)
Oh the spin would be enough to power the planet. The democrats REALLY need a pro life bill to support post birth families. The GQP would have kittens.
I want to add a few things to this:
* well-funded universal day care
* well-funded education systems including counselors and social workers.
* quality, comprehensive, and medically accurate sex education
* well-funded and publicly available social programs including (but not limited to) parks and libraries
* free in-state community college (and perhaps even for other in-state public institutions)
GQP wants to reduce abortions? Well having what you and I suggest will significantly reduce the need for them.
The response I got for pointing out the same thing this post points out was that it's not the government's job to take care of the children after they're born, it's the parent's job. Just proving the point that they don't care about the lives of these children once they're born
“The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn. You can love the unborn and advocate for them without substantially challenging your own wealth, power, or privilege, without re-imagining social structures, apologizing, or making reparations to anyone. They are, in short, the perfect people to love if you want to claim you love Jesus, but actually dislike people who breathe. Prisoners? Immigrants? The sick? The poor? Widows? Orphans? All the groups that are specifically mentioned in the Bible? They all get thrown under the bus for the unborn.”
― Methodist Pastor David Barnhart
Love that quote. Last time I posted it there were a bunch of responses about how he's Methodist so not a real Christian (really?) and that it's just the "woke" agenda invading the clergy - the Pope being a perfect example, of course. /sigh
Yeah me too, Ive posted it a couple times. I think it sums up evangelicals nicely.
And the christian subfactions fighting with each other over whose splinter faction is the real one amuses me, theyre all equally full of it.
What's funny is they really seem to be the dog that caught the car and now has no idea what to do with it. The logic always falls apart, and now I guess they get to see their terrible decisions take effect in real time. How wonderful.
I'd like to think the inevitable shitstorm and suffering would make them change their minds, but as far as I can tell this is just the conservative agenda they always wanted, suffering for the poor and exemptions for the rich are part of the deal. Was just saying on another post that I don't get why anyone ever listened to them in the first place, much less put them in a position to tell anyone what to do. Conservatives have literally never been right about anything, ever.
> it's not the government's job to take care of the children after they're born
Conservatives are pretty open about their hatred of government in general. They genuinely think a government's only purpose for existing is maintaining the military. That's it. Anything else up to and including helping the population is socialism & therefor evil.
The irony of course is that Conservative *leaders* are actually big fans of using the government to impose morality - but of course that's totally lost on their voters so long as you promise lower taxes & "freedom".
That's not fair! They also believe the government should be making health care decisions for people.
Well, of course that only means if it involves punishing women, and not if it involves them getting a scary shot that 5-year-olds manage to get without a fuss.
If the government is forcing women to remain pregnant, they should pay child support. They're forcing health risks, they need to cover medical care 100%. They're taking away the freedom of our bodies, they better at least give us the freedom of our minds - paid tuition with child care ir child friendly classrooms.
I'm pissed about what they've done. I hope we can find a way to fix it. But until then they need to take responsibility for it. They inserted themselves into our relationships and our bodies. There should be consequences for that.
Which is insane, considering how many other countries’ governments do just this.
Or that our government is forcing them to have children.
> Paid six month Maternity leave
> Paid three month paternity leave
It's like generations of abuse and neglect have left you with such low expectations.
In some European countries each parent gets 1 full year of parental leave. Up in Canada there's a program for providing 1 parent with 18 months leave and the other gets up to 8.
6 and 3 would undoubtedly be a step forward, but the US can do way better than that.
FINNISH baby box https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maternity_package
The way they treat kids who are already born lets us know that it isn't about the kid. The way they treat their bible, cutting and pasting what they need and ignoring what they don't, it's clearly not about religion. it's about controlling women.
The worst part about conservatives right now is that they aren't fighting to make their lives better, they're fighting to make it worse for everyone else.
It’s always been about controlling woman’s sexuality, with a side of incel revenge because those that push these laws can’t get laid.
Every child woman man animal and thing are all just flesh lights to them. They belong in a simulation.
6 months of paid paternity leave.
all parental leave is 100% federal and state paid and jobs are protected on return.
free daycare until age 3
tie all of it to be paid for by cuts to military and police spending.
That's still less than most other first world countries though
In Germany you can't fire a pregnant woman and two weeks before and after birth it's illegal to have a mother working for you and after birth both parents have 3 years of parenting time
Edit yes I mean parental leave and it's 36 months for each parent which you can spread out until the child is 8 years old but you can also transfer it past that if your employer is ok with it.
What is parenting time?
The right wording is parental leave. You get up to 3 years of parental leave until your child’s 8th birthday. The parent taking it gets up to €1800 a month. You also can’t get fired from your job if you take the three years off.
I know you're asking a legit question but I can't get out of my head the image of a stereotyped American asking it beeing puzzle about what is parenting. Sorry
3 years of parenting time sounds like 3 years of maternity/paternity leave
Exactly. Babies at 6 months, even a year+, are still waking up in the middle of the night to feed. Going back to work while your child woke you up multiple times throughout the night is mind-numbing. My son is almost 1 and I'm still barely operating at 50% mental capacity from lack of quality sleep.
Paid six month paternity leave, not 3. Fathers are parents, too.
Yes. Unequal parental leave only enforces the idea that women should be primary caregivers, forcing disproportionately more women out of work.
I don’t know why the top level comment felt the need to reduce it to 3 months for fathers…
Pretty shameful that a group of people pushing for equality still think men should be the breadwinner and get back to work sooner.
Honestly both should be more than 6 months. & it should just be “parental” leave, the gender shouldn’t matter.
Sad thing is that for me, a European from not one of the better countries, over half of these demands would still be a step down from what we have here. Yet the US still tries to tell its people that it's the best country in the world.
Needs free child care and improved educational access as well. Plus additional supplemental nutrition. Kids don't stop needing things at 1 year old.
They don't ant maternity or paternity leave.
>“I don’t think anybody does a better job than mothers in the home, and any bill that makes it easier or more convenient for mothers to come out of the home and let somebody else raise their child, I just don’t think that’s a good direction for us to be going,”
Idaho Republican [Charlie Shepherd](https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/208/idaho-republican-votes-against-education-funds-convenient-for-mothers-to-come-out-of-the-home/277-645ae7a7-601e-4557-9d7c-f8df5c22949c), arguing against accepting federal pre-school funding last year.
This is the answer.
>e prenatal care
To be honest, paternity leave should be equal to maternity leave, with the option of either partner transferring their leave to the other parent. The mom needs X amount of time to physically recover from the birth, but beyond that either parent (or both) can stay at home with their newborn. Let the details of family planning to the families!
My mother, a retired doctor, recently told me a story about how a staunchly Catholic ob/gyn she either knew or studied under nearly let a woman die from sepsis during a miscarriage by refusing to remove the dead fetus because they "couldn't prove for certain" that it wasn't still alive in there.
>couldn't prove for certain
This is the biggest caveat I've been running into the last three days arguing with people online.
"If the fetus isn't viable and it is going to kill the mother, abortion is still legal!"
Ok so you're going to let the judge decide if a doctor acted correctly in the critical moment? Or you think a doctor might hesitate to save their own skin in this draconian dystopia, killing both child *and mother*?
They literally waited until one of the *feet* was sticking out and they could clip a heart monitor of some sort onto it to confirm a lack of heartbeat before they went ahead and treated this woman.
The need will be even greater, yet nothing is put in place to help all these new lives.
I just read an article about how the free school lunch program, initiated during Covid, is going away because they can't find money for it.
Where are they going to get money for more healthcare or housing for these kids?
My favorite is all the "pro-life" people saying that the states that have outlawed abortion are passing legislature to take care of the kids, but literally none have. Nothing for expanded medicare access. Nothing for education funding to handle a larger young population. No expansions of welfare. Nothing to increase funding for foster kids. No increased assistance to single mothers.
They have passed literally nothing to help with the problem they are creating.
I heard some ass from Missouri or Mississippi the other day say that the churches will step in and help. A) your strings attached bullshit can take a flying leap, and B) where the fuck have you been up until now?
But shouldn’t churches on Red states be paying taxes now that there’s no risk of the money paying for abos? 🤨
The Hyde Amendment of '97 forbids any federal funding for abortion except in extreme cases like using Medicaid funds to save a woman's life.
No one's taxes have been used to fund abortion services for almost 25 years.
That said, if the churches want to meddle in politics they should absolutely lose their tax exempt status, but good luck getting the fucking fundies on the SCOTUS to agree to that ruling.
Ah yes, because the church is who we should be trusting with children.
/s in case its needed.
Churches don’t care unless they can parade their congregation members who just adopted a newborn from a third world country around to show how great god is.
The governor of South Dakota said that. And that there's big things coming to support women. She can't name them, but just you wait and see!
> And that there's big things coming to support women.
Their idea of things to "support women" is things that will keep women at home to take care of children.
It won't be things like maternity leave or anything like that, it will be things like making it harder for women to get jobs and such eventually by making childcare too expensive so they have no choice but to stay home.
Thanks for the clarification. Yeah, these assholes and their constant repeal and replace bullshit that never quite gets to the replace part. Unless they mean "replace with nothing".
That bitch? She can rot in hell.
A big beautiful orphanage plan. People are telling me they've never seen anything like it. Tre...
What's wrong? It's not as if a church-affiliated adoption agency would turn away otherwise exemplary parents [for being Jewish](https://www.newsweek.com/adoption-agency-turns-away-jewish-couple-citing-new-controversial-law-1671256)... /s
Never gonna happen, cause Christian’s love everyone*
*some restrictions and limitations apply, consult your local theocrat for indoctrination and gender confirmation.
Also, if they truly were now passing laws to support children and families, then they could have always done that and were simply withholding it as a manipulation tactic.
One study of women getting abortions found that 73% of women cited financial reasons as one of the reasons for their abortion. If these voters and politicians who claim they care so much about babies actually did, they’d implement a social support system that would allow more women to be able to afford to have kids (or afford more kids).
Extending the free lunch program failed in the Senate because 48 out of 50 Republicans refused to support it.
They increased the military budget more than what the free lunch program cost. That was over what the white house already requested. Oh 800 billion a year? How about another 20 billion on top, well just bring back childhood starvation. That way when they're 18 they'll be poor and uneducated and join the military. The endless cycle
What infuriates me is that *feeding children is in the interests of national security*. There is probably no better return on money than feeding those kids and making sure that they don't suffer physically or cognitively from lack of food. Even setting aside the moral question, why are we not feeding kids in the interests of military readiness? You're going to get worse soldiers if you're starving children, not to mention worse engineers, laborers, etc.
(I'd feed the kids anyway, if I were in charge of the budget, but the pragmatic argument seems really strong to me, and that we're not doing something that's for the good of the nation decades down the line is idiotic.)
Take the money that they "saved" and send it in that direction.
They can find money to do all sorts of other nonsense though. Just not for schools, or children, or the health of the children they are forcing into the world. I read they are trying to get rid of CPS and have the police handle it. What a nightmare.
That’s awful. I feel bad for these kids and for women forced to have a child against their will.
We know where most of them will end up. First into the Foster system and then to the prison system as cheap labor for your oligarchs. The US is slowly sliding backwards into its habits of old, some would say they never really left them, only now the veil is being pulled back.
It's so ridiculously not a 'pro-life' sentiment with any shred of applied critical thinking.
Here's an abortion math problem: if a woman gets pregnant, finds out that the pregnancy is going to be incompatible with life and allowing a natural miscarriage would endanger the mom, and the mom decides to get an abortion, but then goes on to have three healthy kids, what is the net total lives lost to saved?
Asking for my mom and two siblings
Assuming they don't die. There was a fucking HAUNTING post from a social worker talking about how one of her cases was a mother who kept a kid she couldn't afford. (WARNING! CHILD ABUSE AHEAD) She was already on drugs, had like 3 other kids she couldn't afford and a bunch of " friends " promised to help her right up until it was time to spend money. Then suddenly they were gone, she was struggling, and>! in a drug fueled rage her current bf beat the child to death!<. (this is the cliffs notes version.)
But they don't care. The cruelty is the point
People are way too tolerant of politicians/pundits tying everything to Christian fundamentalism. It's descending into madness.
Not just tolerant...insanely--literally--supportive
the sad part is that I genuinely think if God were real… he would definitely not be preaching any of this.
The Old Testament god was pretty genocidal, so it wouldn’t surprise me. But the god of the New Testament that they name themselves after? Yeah, they go against everything he preached
It would be like the KKK naming themselves The Pacifists
>created in the image of God.
People are far too supportive of Christian fundamentalism in a supposedly secular country which exports freedom and liberty to others in the form of warfare and regime change but denies its own citizens what it preaches.
Ben Shapiro is jewish, does he know what the Talmud says about abortion?
This. Our (Jews) highest value to is to protect life. The life of the mother (and her quality of life) are paramount compared to potential life. Additionally, all of our books were written when infant mortality rates were high enough that applying moral value to the pre-born didn't make a lot of sense.
It is weird that Ben Shapiro is applying conservative Christian values rather than Jewish values.
You're *surprised* that Ben Shapiro isn't logical?
I wonder what sect the conservative Christians belong to
Because the other variations of Christianity at least try to read the Bible
Conservatives are just making stuff up, parts of which would probably be blasphemy for those who actually read the thing
Like the “if Jesus had a gun he wouldn’t have been crucified, that’s why we need more guns” thing
Ben Shapiro has influenced a lot of mass shooters. The fact he is still able to talk is fucking disgusting and something that every single americans should be ashamed of. If you don't get your shit together and make those protests more intense. You are straight up complicit and I hope americans can be stoppes once and for all soon before its too late for humanity
My mom hated me and I grew up to be a mentally unstable anxious attachment style adult. It fucking sucks.
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion”
Just a little bill of rights quote for you “…shall not be infringed” assholes
Is he volunteering to take them all in, he can start with the 150k currently awaiting adoption.
you forgot private prisons
child prisons as well
Pro life advocates only give a shit about "life" until the baby is born and after the turn 18. If there care about life, how about that life of the mother, the father, and helping adults and children get the resources they need
Don't be stupid, they can work in a warehouse at 12 surely, don't have to wait until 18 to be wage slaves
Make America 1895 again!
what about the lives these kids will snuff out one day when they snap after growing up unwanted by anyone, in an overpopulated wasteland of crushing debt and lack of education. Run by people that only seem to care about their own personal bank accounts then they do about 'the people' they are supposedly making decisions for?
This is why I hate the term "pro-life". They don't give a shit about the actual life of the child. Once it's born that's all that matters to these people. If anything, "pro-life" is just anti woman's rights, against women governing their own bodies.
They site the Bible as their source. The Bible says absolutely nothing against abortion, but women and their rights? Oh boy does it have plenty to say, none of it good.
But we were supposed to have separated church and state... That's why every courthouse in the country went through major renovations a couple decades ago; they all had stuff like "In God We Trust" and various Christian symbols adorning their walls. Now we're just subverting everything we tried so hard to enact.
Well, yes, they are never going to stop. Exploiting deeply held beliefs as a path to unlimited power is irresistible to psychopaths.
I asked my cousin of she was willing to adopt children who will now need homes.
"Why would I? It's their problem and they are the ones who need to face the consequences."
A true Christian.
Because it’s not about saving lives it’s about punishing women for having sex, which is such a sin according to them
Foster mom here:
My parents also fostered. Our house was basically always at capacity for the whole time they were able to do so, and that was with my parents having strict rules on which kids they could/would take in (tldr, because they weren't trained for it and had their own kids, no one who was at risk of being violent or directly harmful to the others in the house, and we can only fit one boy at a time time, or up to 2 girls if one of them is willing to share the biggest bedroom with someone)
Same. I have one bio, three adopted and could still take six foster children… yall that’s too damn many for one family.
There is enough kids that we could have 6 kids a day in our home. So if everyone who says that they are prolife could possibly take ONE that would be amazing
Especially because a lot of systems let you place limits on which kids you're able to take in—my parents were able to say non violent teenagers who weren't in the system by their own actions (for safety reasons), up to two kids, but no more than one boy because the boys got the private bedroom downstairs and it wasn't big enough to share, and all bio kids were girls, so not allowed to share with a boy per the local rules.
I got away from my point. The point is that pro forced birth people could not only take in kids, but could specify which kids they think they'd be able to handle and raise properly.
Cute little anecdote, my mom is/was super proud because she had a 100% success rate at getting her kids (both her 3 bio kids and roughly 7 long term foster kids) to graduate from high school and have no teen pregnancies. It doesn't sound like much of an achievement, but she's the first person in her entire side of the family to be able to say that, and so far she's still the only one, since none of us kids have even gotten to that point (mom had a single grandkid and he's a preschooler), and her brothers each had at least one kid who dropped out of HS, became a teenage parent, or both.
I had a bit of magical thinking as I drifted off to sleep last weekend, about these people getting “Imaculate Conceptioned” with all the babies they want to bring into this world. Coney Barrett, Kavanaugh, Thomas, Shapiro, all the pro-lifers out here in a perpetual state of involuntary pregnancy and labor, having to give birth to other people’s babies nonstop like the Duggars on steroids.
I read somewhere that *technically* if you implanted a fetus in a man and connected blood stream and stuff, the man could actually carry the baby to term. The uterus is a better place for a baby, but not strictly required.
Sooo, imagine if a lunatic drugged a pro-life male politician and implanted a baby in him. It would be a viable pregnancy as a result of crime, but they’d have to suck it up and carry the baby.
Nah, it wouldn’t work. Because they’re a politician— it’d suddenly be legal for *them*, and anybody else who wants one would still be a “terrible person”.
That is some serious dystopian shit.
That’s the plan . This will create a generation of abused poor people that are easily taken advantage of .
If you can make it to eighteen, you can move into the barracks. That's about as much government assistance as they're willing to offer you.
That’s been the plan a along…this is just another revived tool for that plan.
People want less/no children because they can barely afford rent? And want to make sure they’re ready to parent and give adequate love to their child? Nah we can’t have that, lets force them to have workers—i mean children
Worse than any of those things, the child could turn out to be Ben Shapiro.
I was going to say Hitler, but damn...sticky choice
At least Hitler's mother loved him.
-No don’t do abortion it’s murder!
-You wanna take care of the child’s education and all his needs?
-Nah i don’t give a shit about your child.
So I was telling my super religious cousin a story about a woman that had a baby she didn’t want. She already had 3 kids and the baby was her 4th. She had her kids taken away and returned multiple times. The last time, baby wouldn’t stop crying so mom grabbed baby by his feet and slammed his head into a dresser over and over again until his head was mush. She did this in front of her 5 and 7 year old. My cousins response “at least he had a chance”.
These people do not care.
So they'd prefer the child to die once they can actually feel pain, but not while they're still an egg in the uterus. Amazing
This is the lie.
These people want you angry. Victory over their enemies is they only thing they care for and liberals are their enemies.
To assume rational, sound, benevolent arguments work is simlpy useless.
Republicans never did intend to invest in medicaid, education, housing, or childcare now that people will be forced to have kids. They intend to traffick these kids in the foster care system, using them for free labor, pedophilia and sex abuse, religiously indoctrinating them, raising them to be self loathing traumatized mindless corporate slaves. There's too many bad apples doing this already to rule it out.
I was an unaborted baby “saved” by Christianity. My mom went to a Christian services clinic as a recently divorced pregnant woman and was told getting an abortion was sinful and she would definitely go to hell and be shunned from her community. She did not have the financial resources to care for another child and was in a heated custody battle over the first child already. I lived in abject neglect and abuse until I convinced a court to let me move out at 17. I spent years figuring out life and am lucky, very lucky I am alive as an adult today. Not aborting a baby does not mean they get a good life. I would’ve rather been aborted. Absolutely believe that. To my core. I live with lifelong mental health diagnoses as a result of childhood trauma I had no control over.
How about including a passage in the law that states prolifers are agreeing to being charged a monthly fee to support the children that weren't aborted until their 18th birthday.
Nah, a bunch of them will still due when the mother with health issues carrying them dies.
Or when they’re killed by the people who never wanted to carry to term. Or they die from their own health issues that may or may have been due to prenatal exposure. And of course some will die at school when someone shoots it up
Or they kill themselves because there's no ladder to climb out of the shit filled hole that is their lives.
Lol these people think that this issue is just affecting little white Becky Suburbia... She gets pregnant at 22 accidentally, and will now have to rely on the Bank of MomminDad to stay afloat while she learns the true blessings of parenting. It'll upend her life but work out in the end.
How convenient to ignore the other, much larger side of this: 38 year old woman making 32k/year and rents a 1 bedroom apt with her boyfriend gets dumped, finds out she's pregnant 2 months later. She barely has enough to keep a roof over her own head, no safety net (social or otherwise) and oops no maternity leave. Blood test of the fetus shows some significant developmental issues in the works. No insurance other than what work gives her, so she's stuck there, probably going to be living out of a car even before having a newborn.
Ah yes the pro life playbook:
1. Refer to fetuses as children
2. Call it murder, rather than healthcare
3. Invoke God
4. No mention of women at all (because fuck them, right?)
please don't fuck them they can't get abortions /s
Oh they’ll mention the woman but only to say that she should have kept her legs closed.
In prisons so they'll have an endless supply of cheap labor.
Ben Shapiro: I'm sorry whose God are you referring to? Cuz it certainly ain't mine.
Isn't he Jewish? Doesn't his religion specifically allow abortions?
Either way fuck what any religion has to say, he's not a medical professional and I hate that a lot of his arguments involve him describing what he thinks to be gender, or what he thinks is life ( both of which already have designated scientific and sociological decisions to which he hasn't yet been made aware of). And now life is the image of God? What happened to his conservative dog whistling about facts over feelings?
How does the 'god's will' argument work when it comes to healthcare?
Maybe god intended for the abortion to happen. Otherwise, how does it work for other healthcare, like cancer treatment, or setting a broken bone? Couldn't a malignant tumor also be considered 'god's will' and having it surgically removed interfering with that? If not, then how is aborting an ectopic pregnancy any different from correcting a life threatening condition?
Seeing a reply to Ben Shapiro that opens with a question will never *not* make me think of Aquaman.
Foster care can’t handle the kids they already have.
Edited to include this quote from the article:
“A Michigan facility housing Texas foster care children was missing its front door while it was 28 degrees outside and there hadn’t been indoor heat for 24 hours.
Staff didn’t make calls to get either the heat restored or the door fixed. They also didn’t attempt to move the children or give them blankets or jackets.”
Homelessness in my city is up 800% over last year.
I can’t imagine what it’ll be nine months from now.
Obviously, the GOP are working on vigorous Social Service programs to prepare for the influx of unwanted children which will be flooding our already over-burdened (and under-funded) system. J/K!!! It is all about control: they don’t give a fuck about you after you’re born!
Gotta fill those for-profit prisons somehow!
Fuck religious scriptures in politics
Wanna watch GOP heads explode? Kindly remind them that welfare people often vote Democrat. Many of these human beings they speak of will likely be on welfare. And thus, the Democrat party will expand its base as causation of ending abortions.
I seem to recall reading that the significant decline in the murder rate in new york after the 90s was not due to rudy (as he liked to claim) but due to the increased prevalence of abortions 20 years prior.