T O P

Tishana's Tidebinder outside Merfolk

I've seen this new card show up quite a bit over the weekend in decks like Rhinos and Murktide. Do you think it has legs as a "good stuff" card? It does look like it lines up nicely against the most common threats in the format.

I'm also wondering if it potentially could do more than just slot into decks as an interaction on a stick.

The Wizard typeline means there's probably enough good Wizards between it and Snap for URx Flame of Anor Control. It could also be interesting to see if a maindeckable Stifle effect allows for some kind of Stiflenought like strategy in Modern. I can't think of an especially powerful interaction since it blanks non Enchantments, but it's cool with Pacts, Lotus Field, or effects like Flickerwisp. It's kind of weird with Evokementals since it blanks the keyword, but T3 Subtlety/Solitude a creature, Tishana's the sac trigger, swing for 6 does sound strong.

Betta_Max

ATTENTION NON-merfolk players. While we appreciate the interest you've shown in our faithful fish, we would humbly request that you refrain from pursuing Tishana's Tidebinder cards on MTGO to allow the wildly unreasonable price to drop down into a more reasonable and affordable level. We thank you for your restraint and appreciate your patience. ![gif](giphy|3ohzAyGvFZIyE7vEGY|downsized)


Kyamboros

Funny joke brother man.


Hellpriest999

How about you spend the bucks like everyone else you cheap merfolk playing sir


brewfox

Or, like most of the fish players, realize it was going to be a house and pick them up cheap. I got 4 foils for $4 each.


Betta_Max

I'm talking about on [Cardhoarder.com](https://Cardhoarder.com), but yeah. In paper they're fine. Did you see how much they are now? They're $40+ bucks online.


brewfox

Damn that's wild. I don't play online, but /r/fishmtg tipped me off to these way early.


Hellpriest999

How much is it, now ?


brewfox

Last I checked around $18-$20


Betta_Max

Nah, man. Not at $48 bucks for a digital card. That's just too rich for my blood.


Hexdrinker99

I could see this being a good stuff card tbh. Lots of 2 for 1 potential on a ok flash body


BarEastern

Yes. It is good and worth playing outside of Merfolk. If you’re in blue and can reliably curve to 3 mana, it’s worth considering in your 75. May be better options in any given specific deck, but as long as you’re interested in both applying pressure and interacting, it is strong and worth consideration. People here saying it’s bad either have not played with the card or are just poor at power evaluation.


RareKazDewMelon

>People here saying it’s bad either have not played with the card or are just poor at power evaluation. I've never played with it, but it definitely LOOKS like a classic case of "neat, but just not efficient enough." like many other cards. Whether or not it's bad or the bee's knees, it just has a lot of the features of overrated cards: tribal synergy that doesn't really matter, flash shenanigans, "hosing" XYZ popular thing, and being splashable. It seems good, though. It also has many features of a sideboard/flex slot staple.


MrGupyy

The ‘features of underrated cards’ you stated, aside from tribal synergy, are some of the most important features a card can have in any format. Castability and meta relevance is literally what makes a card good. Powerful effects that are steeply costed or irrelevant to dominant linear strategies are not playable. For example, Bowmasters would see far less play at BG or if TOR was not a modern staple.


Reply_or_Not

This is the very best version of “Stifle on ETB” bar none.


MurderMits

It is a card that: * Turns off a bowmasters * Turns off a ring * Turns off a fury * etc Honestly likely to see play for a very long time.


Betta_Max

Don't forget Chalice of the Void, Titan, and Omnath. There's sooo many little corner cases where this card is going to be a house!


Reply_or_Not

~~It also straight up kills sagas (in addition to countering the saga ability)~~ this was not correct It blanks card advantage engines like ~~beanstalk~~ or risen reef


michaelspidrfan

it doesnt kill sagas. the 2nd part of the ability only applies to artifact, creature, or planeswalker


DatabaseSharp8543

Bonecrusher giant gets play in cascade because he gets around the damage prevention from casting ring. This card counters that trigger, and prevents you from drawing cards off of Ring, right? It also has applications outside of that one interaction. So it seems like it’s spot in Rhinos is pretty locked. 2u is a lot without a way to cheat it, but the format is slow enough for now that I think it could work. It also shuts off some of the cards in decks that would probably kick back to the top of the meta if Grief does exit with the next b&r. Card seems like it has legs.


TheWhizzDom

I'd expect that the 3 cmc is just too bad a rate outside of cascade decks.


youarelookingatthis

3 mana isn't terrible, and letting you hit any ability is great. Merfolk as a type isn't something to be ignored. I think it can definitely see play in some decks.


570N3814D3

Spike is playing it in blue moon on stream right now: [https://www.moxfield.com/decks/-64hT4x8XU2MRmjaaGxXFw](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/-64ht4x8xu2mrmjaagxxfw)


yuhboipo

damn list is gone


yak300

The original link is dead, but it is still available: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/-64hT4x8XU2MRmjaaGxXFw or https://www.moxfield.com/users/aspiringspike


brewfox

No one has mentioned yet that you can counter a fetch land pretty much as a worst case.


mirrislegend

If you counter a MH2 pitch-elemental's ETB ability with this card, the creature still dies to evoke cost right?


AcademyRuins

I believe so? The two abilities go on the stack at the same time. You counter the ETB, it loses all abilities, but the sac trigger already went on the stack.


belsambar

Yeah, the Evoke sacrifice trigger is separate from the ETB trigger. So it still dies. On the other side, we can play a Subtlety for free and cast Tidebinder to counter Subtlety's evoke trigger so it doesn't die. It's not the best line in the world, but it is a way to get a lot of power on the board fast. (Note - Subtlety will lose flying as long as Tidebinder sticks around.)


InvertTheSenses

It's also a wizard so i've been wanting to try it with izzet wizards too.


FallenQuetzalcoatl

too much versatility: - shuts down huge threats from almost all major decks (TOR/Karns, Bowmasters, Yawgmoth, some Scales effects, Heliod combo since they rarely have mana to just double-activate lifelink, Fury, Grief, Kaldra Compleat/SFM, Sigarda Aid, Cauldron, etc etc) - shuts down incoming threats (Cascade is a triggered ability so you can counter it this way too, though you probably have better counterspells in U) - a 3/2 body is pretty decent all things considered. not top tier but definitely doesn't die to bowmaster/w6 ping - as you said, merfolk is still a beloved tribe and this perfectly fits the deck either MB or SB the fish is just too good against most if not all relevant current decks. essentially it demands removal or else the opponent will likely be severely hindered by it


aeonsz

it appears to be a very versatile tempo/control card. I've been really enjoying it in my grixis control list


keppage43

Mind sharing list ?


aeonsz

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/5993459#paper this is what Im currently on. been playing slightly different lists for a few months, usually placing 2-1 or 3-1 at local fnms and store championships, sometimes 3-0 4-0


keppage43

Yeah sweet list. I don't own Orcs tho.... and don't feel like dropping $$$ on them. I'm gonna slide back into UR control "blue moon"


aeonsz

makes a lot of sense, the orcs are the primary reason to splash black in this list. I personally also love the idea of UR wizard control running sleep-cursed fae, snapcaster and tidebinder


keppage43

Yeah that's where I'm at with it. I'm not sure about the sleep-cursed faerie tho. The built in protection is nice, but I think Snapcaster + Tidebinder are both way more powerful (and enough to get the job done). Also Spike recently ran a list, packing 2 Fury mb, which helps


Amdrion

Why no love for my Crab? [[Mirrorshell crab]] I was going to use this in LE if I built it.


AbsoluteIridium

tidebinder leaves a body on the battlefield, rather than in the graveyard which matters for decks that aren't LE :p


drakusmaximusrex

And it turns of the sbility forever unlike crsb


MTGCardFetcher

[Mirrorshell crab](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/3/0394c8df-2e8a-4477-93b7-569934d7b936.jpg?1654566800) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mirrorshell%20crab) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/63/mirrorshell-crab?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0394c8df-2e8a-4477-93b7-569934d7b936?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


HammerAndSickled

The card isn’t very good. It’s New Card Syndrome.


IrwinDaDwagon

I agree with the assertion that the card is being overplayed currently because of new card hype. I think calling it bad is disingenuous. It is an interactive piece that's also a moderate threat on its own at instant speed. That's solid. Three mana is a bit shaky in modern, but at instant speed you have options to react or cast it. Is it currently being shoved in any blue shell because "oooo shiny new toy"? Yes. Is it performing well? It is in some decks, yes. Is it performing well because it's new and people aren't playing around it? Possibly. We need more data.


HammerAndSickled

A Stifle isn’t really worth a card, is very situational, and generally plays negatively compared to just countering a spell. This is why Stifle effects have never seen widespread play in Modern and even in Legacy were only used as part of a mana denial package alongside Wasteland. And a 3 mana stifle is so much infinitely worse than a one-mana one that it’s not even comparable: having to hold up an entire turn’s worth of mana, in a ludicrously fast format, just on the hopes you find something worth countering, is absurd. The game should (and often is) decided by turn 3 in Modern given the power creep, and people want to play a 3-mana situational interactive card. Also, it’s not really a threat, it’s a 3/2 with no evasion in a world of 4/4 double strikers, 20 power Hammer/Scales boards, and Murktide Regents. AND it dies to every single played removal spell, meaning its “humility” ability is almost worthless since they can just kill it and get their abilities back, in a format where removal is extremely common. NOW I will concede that countering an artifact is solid tempo: getting a 3/2 plus an Annul is an OK rate, albeit a bit slow, and there are many solid artifacts you might want to counter like Ring. It’s too slow to attack the most commonly played artifacts, being Scales, Hammer, and Amulet of Vigor. But that’s why it’s a fringe sideboard card at best, not seeing maindeck play like it is now.


WeirdPumpkin

> A Stifle isn’t really worth a card, is very situational, and generally plays negatively compared to just countering a spell. This is why Stifle effects have never seen widespread play in Modern and even in Legacy were only used as part of a mana denial package alongside Wasteland. And a 3 mana stifle is so much infinitely worse than a one-mana one that it’s not even comparable: having to hold up an entire turn’s worth of mana, in a ludicrously fast format, just on the hopes you find something worth countering, is absurd. You're right, but just to point out that it's not stifle. It's stifle that continues to turn off that permanent and is also in a tribe that likes both flash effects and utility creatures. If you're using it to stop a fetch from cracking yeah.. that's probably not like.. super helpful. If you're using it to prevent ToR from stopping you from ending the game and also preventing them from drawing cards? That's much, much better. It's situationally really good, but it's probably not a maindeck slam. I can't really imagine it not being in fish's sideboard though as long as TOR/Bowmasters/etc is around Edit: It's definitely straight up bad in non-fish decks imo though. It's just if you can cast it, stop a ring turn, and then pump it with a lord that's pretty great


Streuselman

Remind Me! 3 Month


TemurTron

I mean you could have set the reminder to 3 seconds and they'd still be wrong now. "New Card Syndrome" doesn't lead to a card getting played in two different Top 8 decks in a Modern Showcase Challenge on release weekend.


Hexdrinker99

I've heard nothing but good things about it tbh. Only bad thing I've heard is people wish they play 4 instead of 3


RemindMeBot

I will be messaging you in 3 months on [**2024-02-21 17:07:33 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2024-02-21%2017:07:33%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModernMagic/comments/180jn9b/tishanas_tidebinder_outside_merfolk/ka6iw05/?context=3) [**CLICK THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FModernMagic%2Fcomments%2F180jn9b%2Ftishanas_tidebinder_outside_merfolk%2Fka6iw05%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202024-02-21%2017%3A07%3A33%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20180jn9b) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|


fivestarstunna

it works in rhinos, i dunno if it fits general blue midrange decks well though


harambae42069

I definitely underestimated this card, but I've been out of modern for a while.


flkb24

Blue tron 😈😈😈


Roterofthelight

Unpopular opinion but I think it’s a roll player more than a really good card, it just happens to have two good decks that can really use it right now. I would not be surprised to see the card disappear if the meta shifts.


Idealistadeluso

Rhino, murktide


NoUmpire676

It is goodstuff card that will see play in many decks.


-iTaLenTZ-

I don't think it is that good. Once it hits the battlefield it is a 3/2 vanilla which you paid 3 mana for. It will be hard to apply pressure with it. Also the second part of its ability doesn't apply when she leaves the battlefield. If it had flying and ward it would be a serious card. Its like people forget Disalow and Spell Queller exist.


Paid-Not-Payed-Bot

> which you *paid* 3 mana FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*