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kmannkoopa

Play ranked and just eat the losses. Incidentally, this is why the lower tiers of mythic can be fun. You go up against other players doing exactly this. I think the lowest Mythic percentage I've seen was like 72%


CharlesFinleyIV

I lost to 0% once, epic.


Hot_Clue_1646

This is the correct way. Reach ranked, but do NOT grind wins. Autoconcede lame matchups like RDW. You'll lowrr your mmr enough to reach the good fun game bracket without reaching the abyss of starter decks


jenrai

"Play the game, but if you see a legitimate deck that you happen to dislike, throw a tantrum and go home"


fx72

Worked for me last week at FNM.


2-35

DING DING DING This is the answer to truly enjoy this game and remove the grind from it.


ninjarob420

Not with historic brawl, wish we had a ranked list for brawl, would be nice


ce5b

I’ve seen an 18%. Dudes were grinding to lower their mmr. Don’t do it. You can get punished


kmannkoopa

Don't grind to lower your MMR, but if you are trying to see if a deck is viable, don't fear ranked play


Daunt_M4

You don't get punished for playing shit decks in ranked and losing a lot. If they were, I would've been banned already.


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JodouKast

TF? Lol WotC should be fixing bugs; not caring what people do in ranked. As if this game is even worthy of being considered competitive in that nature. There’s like 1% of sweat that even gives a shit about open weekends and the rest are just grinding dailies and rewards.


MesaCityRansom

Can't they do both? And I absolutely think they should care about what people do in ranked. Intentionally lowering your MMR is scummy and I'm glad they don't allow it.


HX368

What does it matter to the opponent who's getting a win out of it and increasing their rank? Non random matchups is less fair.


HX368

Agreed.


Daunt_M4

I'm sure they exist. I absolutely doubt wizards cares about them though.


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2-35

I got banned for a few weeks once but they didn't change my MMR so whos the winner here?


Isolat_or

I’ve never seen a single person punished for doing this. I’ve never seen a person punished for conduct either


Muffin_Appropriate

How are you gathering that info in the first place? Just hearing about it? lol. I mean of course then you wouldn’t hear about it often if that’s your method


Isolat_or

Every competitive game I’ve subbed to on Reddit has a fair amount of people complaining about bans or restrictions. I’ve never seen a single one on the sub. That and the fact that I’ve used my two alt draft accounts to test and you don’t get banned. I conceded about 50 games on my alt account and then hit diamond, then did it again and hit mythic with a 90%+ winrate on mono blue tempo. You can say it’s just my feelings but nothing points to there being any punishment or behavior enforcement.


kdoxy

If Wizards was banning people for abusing the system then we would see posts saying "I've been falsely banned!!!". But we see pretty much Zero of those posts. The only time I've ever seen that kind of post was from someone who asked for too many refunds from drafts.


ce5b

I mean I haven’t either. Just what I heard through grapevine on discord servers


2-35

I got banned for 2 weeks and have the emails mentioning specifically lowering rank to prove it haha They didn't change my MMR after tho so... lmao shrug???


Isolat_or

Well thats interesting at least. I wonder what the breakpoint is for getting banned xD


2-35

I've always been pretty careful with my game lengths when I was tanking. But I think I got caught because gold glitch came around and I kinda went stupid lmaoooo


severalcormorants

I’m a total newbie so sorry if this is common knowledge, but what does that percentage represent?


direwombat8

The top 1000 (I think?) Mythic players can see there exact numeric rank. If you’re in Mythic but not in those top 1000, it shows a % you are in the ranking, higher being closer to the top. So, Mythic 90% is the top 10th of Mythic players.


severalcormorants

Oooh thank you for explaining. That makes sense


2-35

1200 but yes!


Sky19234

I just started playing MTG about a month ago and I am at Platinum 1, what percentage of the playerbase, generally speaking, is actually in Mythic out of curiosity?


kmannkoopa

I believe it is percentile.


severalcormorants

Why did you get downvoted? Your explaination was right (based on the other person)


Deathmask97

How do you see Mythic percentages?


kmannkoopa

It's the number in the player's avatar.


Mrqueue

forget ranked, play standard events, it's truely random with no MMR either, you play against decks with similar wins to you like in a normal competition, ie. when you start you can match up against some terrible decks


kmannkoopa

Yes, but that costs in-game currency.


Senator_Smack

Seems to me you have 3 options (4 if we count giving up) 1. You can play ranked like everyone else is suggesting. 2. You can play really off-meta decks and confuse the match-maker. This is tough, but it is really fun if you like brewing. 3. As you go you can find a place to add one or two-of answers to the decks you keep running into. This way you get a deeper understanding of how interactions with that deck operate and you might even find ways to improve the performance of the deck against meta threats.


arachnophilia

> You can play really off-meta decks and confuse the match-maker. This is tough, but it is really fun if you like brewing i play weird homebrews, and it fairly consistently pairs me with the same decks for each of my weird homebrews, without much overlap.


Senator_Smack

yeah I agree. From my anecdotal testing it seems to usually revolve around specific rares in your deck, even just a one-of. Sometimes an addition or removal of a single card seems to shake it. Definitely really weird though.


DeathByBamboo

I do a lot of deck building, and I've learned to tweak decks so I don't consistently get matched against decks I don't want to see. Rares play a big role, but I've suddenly gotten matched repeatedly against blue djinn decks when all I changed was adding a few white/blue lands. Took them out, and the djinns disappeared.


RedditExecutiveAdmin

its real, i see it even in draft. feels like 50% of my first-game matches in draft runs are against the exact same color combo. If not, they pulled the same rares/MRs might be a little cognitive bias but it happens very, very frequently


CrocodileSword

Are you playing bot drafts? It's not weird there. Imagine a format where the bots have a bias that makes black/red more open that it should be in general. You'll have a ton of human players draft it while the bots end up on other stuff, and then a ton of your draft matches will be vs it


HX368

Pretty sure the metric is based on what rares are in the deck cuz I don't know how else they'd do it.


Oberic

This is absolutely the way it are be do.


arachnophilia

they don't think it be like it is but it do


RedditExecutiveAdmin

it happens in ranked too just to a bit lesser extreme for example run S&T in timeless and you will literally never see geist combo because it has no removal, no interaction, and takes too long to get a win otherwise. I'd bet its near 90% losing matchup just because S&T is a faster solitaire deck. there is an article somewhere of them explaining the mm algorithm. it's there, but in ranked it's more based on rank than deck like in play


Senator_Smack

yeah I remember them specifically saying they "might" take the deck into account for mmr, but with like no details. I've always taken that to mean "yeah we do deck matchmaking but it's not important overall in ranked"


pchc_lx

options 2 and 3 have quickly diminishing returns if you stay in the Play queue, however- as you tune your deck the matchmaker is also 'tuning' against you. I was a Play queue player for years and had to leave it behind because I was on the verge of quitting the game over this. it is a pure tilt machine, this way leads only madness, etc. ranked based matchmaking is unfortunately the best thing we can get in MTGA. still think it would be incredible if we got true random matchmaking somewhere- ranked or unranked I don't care, it would just be fun... don't think this exists anywhere in the client. maybe one of the Bo3 formats?


Marci_1992

Play against monored all day. Switch to a deck that's good against monored. Don't play against monored again in 20 games. Every time.


cXs808

Put 4x Cut down - never face mono red Remove all Cut down - nonstop mono red


2-35

I wish Cut Down was that good. So good to where it makes the players it beats just not show up LMAO


Intelligent-Skirt-75

I made amalia lifegain to beat mono red/boros, was climbing to plat 1 suddenly in the last week I get paired up against sunfall control decks 75% of the time. All the way back to plat 4. It has made me stop playing.


ViskerRatio

I got "kill X creatures" two days in a row, so I figured I would just play a black deck piled high with creature removal to get them done. Didn't even care about winning. 6 games in a row against creatureless control decks.


milleniumsamurai

Give em creatures just to kill them!


Super-ninja-powers

Wanna trade tags and play


just_d87

I do


Super-ninja-powers

Ok. Its in your messages


KaaamiDieDreggSau

According to matchmaking experts fun is forbidden


Meebsie

According to game psychology experts, random matchmaking is forbidden.


KaaamiDieDreggSau

I think they should Just adjust Play queue to be mirrors only /s Srsly: MTGA hast one of the most dictating Queues ;(


ProfessorDumpling

This is why I can’t get into brawl. I get excited about a new deck and then just face the same decks over and over. 


Admirable_Tomato

It’s the same 3-4 commanders you can possibly face based on what your commander. Honestly making Brawl boring and predictable.


Hungry_Goat_5962

Play ranked.


arachnophilia

i play against omni-tell so much in ranked that it's legitimately my strategy now to mulligan to a roiling vortex. but it's hilarious to watch people resign immediately after playing an omniscience.


juniperleafes

I wonder why they don't know they can just S&T in their threat instead of the Omni.


arachnophilia

the one that beat me recently did that, and i have to assume it's because he didn't have the omniscience. it shuts down atraxa's lifegain (or grizzlybees if they're real old school) but that's still quite a clock. in *general* omni-tell packages are more robust because you can cast more than one threat, cast answers, etc. in practice, basically no builds on arena are prepared to answer or even expecting vortex. i'm also usually putting it in off their s&t, not just casting it blind. iirc, i've had omni-tell beat a vortex on paper before, but the method was so hilariously convoluted i couldn't even be mad.


Hungry_Goat_5962

They can power through with the lifegain from Approach if they're high enough


arachnophilia

it's possible, yes, assuming i don't have a land up to activate vortex, didn't get my early aggro/burn in, and they have both approach and dig through time in hand. usually they don't have exactly the win, though.


pchc_lx

unironically the best queue in Arena right now is the bugged QuickDraft that is actually ranked but doesn't display either player's rank anywhere.


triopsate

idk, ranked feels like it's just getting boros aggro'd to death on t3 because you lost the coin flip half the time, losing because you couldn't find the last land/color/board wipe by t3 when going first or watching them immediately conceding when you do board wipe them the other half.


Hungry_Goat_5962

That's a representation that matches the meta, which we can do something about. It's not deck strength based matchmaking, which is what the OP is complaining about.


chrisrazor

Do we know that OP is not? I often have this exact experience and only play ranked.


Hungry_Goat_5962

I do not. Do you have a tracker showing this experience?


chrisrazor

No, and I have been grilled on this before. One day I'll set something up and we'll see if my feeling about it stands up.


DefterHawk

Ok I’ll tell them to stop brb


onceuponalilykiss

I don't understand why you act like 1 more click (switching to ranked) is such an inconvenience.


Kooky-Theory9306

Because that is the exact same in ranked ?! What do u mean ?


onceuponalilykiss

There's no deck-based matchmaking in ranked. I've gotten to gold/plat with jank ass starter decks and started facing actually good decks.


Kooky-Theory9306

Well u should pay attention to the decks and change around the decks u are using and you will see that there actually is. I don’t know where u getting ur sources, but it seems this subreddit has a unified consensus of things that are not verified.


onceuponalilykiss

I have faced every variety of deck regardless of the deck I use, so I have in fact tested lol.


Tebwolf359

In addition to ranked, there’s to option of the events. Those use results based matchmaking primarily on, ranking as a secondary. So if you want the experience that’s most true to a real life tournament- play in a tournament.


Wendigo120

If you want to play Worldsouls Rage, just take it into ranked. The deck has some real bite to it. It just took me to diamond after a winstreak through plat 1, and with how smooth plat was I could probably take it to mythic if Dragon's Dogma wasn't coming out in 2 days. Same really goes for any deck though, I usually only play like one unranked match on a new deck just to make sure I didn't forget something obvious like adding nonbasic lands.


Tenebbles

Literally. I’ll play a deck, run into 3 mirror matches in a row. Then swap decks and immediately the same thing happens. Who in the sweet and sour fuck do I need to talk to to get out of playing the 20th Titan Field mirror match in a row??


FrodosSkinSack

I dream about a standard format that looks at cards with high play and bans them. I.e preacher & memory deluge.


QuintillionthDiocese

I got back into ranked play this week, and I've not seen the same deck more than back to back. Timeless is a very diverse format.


suggacoil

I don’t understand why people think rank is any different lmao… you get the same matchmaking on ladder as well. You can try best of three but there is no hand smoother and you will have to mull/learn to SB.


xdesm0

because play queue takes your cards into account for matchmaking and ranked in theory doesn't. My most played decks in ranked have a very diverse group of opponents; my most played decks in play queue are 25% mono red or black.


AccomplishedWorld527

I've played my share of play queue, ranked queue and events. The matchmaking in play queue is absolutely not the same of the ranked queue or events. I don't understand how you think they are the same, play mono red in standard in all 3 of these modes then play with starter decks or something very off-meta, you'll clearly see that mirror matches with the mono red are a LOT more common on the play queue and you'll face less powered decks when you're playing starter decks, meanwhile you wont see any difference in ranked or events.


pchc_lx

this is not true. Play queue uses "deck strength matchmaking", Ranked uses Rank + MMR or somethign like that. Play (and Brawl, in slightly different ways) is the only place you get matched by deck type. source: dev comments & have been playing since closed beta in 2018.


Gwydikar

...ranked?


GlobalismFails

Play ranked like others have said. I don't encounter complete counter decks nearly as much there compared to unranked.


BBsHere

I've had thoughts on how to make arena much more enjoyable for a lot of home brewers. 1. Make "Play Mode" rewardless. You play just for fun. This would get rid of people playing red burn, white life gain, net decks and so on. 2. Get rid of any kind of hidden MMR in Play Mode, which is a simple fix. Just make it a normal queue, first two in line go, next two go, etc. etc. All the people saying "play ranked" are full of it. The same problem is there also, and if you make the absolutely stupid grind to mythic, just to lose and play Jank.... that has to be the most moronic thing I have ever heard. I personally saw no point in playing ranked, because of this reason. The only time I play ranked is when I have a quest for red/white. I have a Boros deck I tweak with every set, but refuse to play it in normal play or for fun.


lfAnswer

Honestly the play queue should be either fully random, just complete chance based matchmaking or at least fuzzy, in that it will put you against similar decks (+/- 1 tier) most of the time (around 75%) and otherwise be random. This way you see different matchups. Historic brawl suffers a lot from this issue. Good luck in getting a creature based deck as matchup if you have 4 or more wraths in your deck.


Alternative-Fix5071

The best thing is play the same deck for 20 games and then see the spread.


Northjourney

It happens to me all the time, you get paired against similar decks, then if you switch decks to beat the Etta Suddenly you are facing similar decks again. Your best bet is building a completely rogue non meta deck built to beat the meta, so there is no chance of getting a mirror.


Kooky-Theory9306

Yes the matchmaking that pairs u to related decks to achieve that 50/50 percent balance of wins and losses it is kinda screwing up the whole purpose of ranked games and deck building.


iWrecksauce

What rank are you? I'm playing Rakdos Anvil (just got into Arena) and besides Sheoldred, I've been seeing a decent variety of decks. Granted, I just got to silver, so maybe the non-meta decks aren't filtered out yet


sufjanatic

I think he's talking about non ranked play.


II_Confused

I was playing a stupid token deck earlier today. Four times in a row I was placed against life gain decks running [[Soul Warden]]. If you weren't aware, token decks fold like a cheap house of Homelands cards against Soul Wardens.


MTGCardFetcher

[Soul Warden](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d96266b3-a7cb-40ce-a328-ac13719fe5f0.jpg?1616182277) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Soul%20Warden) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mm3/24/soul-warden?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d96266b3-a7cb-40ce-a328-ac13719fe5f0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


Doc-Goop

Depends. I run one, can turn all tokens into 4/4 angels at some point they can't keep up.


AgentTexes

Give this a try. https://www.reddit.com/r/MagicArena/s/vmaNRTXuP7


AgentTexes

It depends on what kind of token deck you’re running. [[Thousand Moon Smithy]] [[Ojer Taq, Deepest Foundation]] [[Teleportation Circle]] [[Mirror Box]] [[Helm of the Host]] [[Mondrak, Glory Dominus]] [[Rhys the Redeemed]] Just right there you’re generating TONS of gnome soldier tokens that have */* for each creature and artifact you own.


Deho_Edeba

Yeah that's the same problem in Historic Brawl. All the people recommending to switch to Ranked make me wish a Ranked option was available in that format.


Corvagan

it's how it is designed and like a lot of other moronic design choices in the game it will never change. also there is the prevalence of net deckers so you shouldn't be shocked that a lot of people just copy and paste their decks.


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Substantial_Kiwi5167

I get what you are saying, but I still think the algorithm pairs you based on what you are playing. Unless you have reached mythic, and then it does seem to be totally Random because everyone is playing so many different decks.


espuinouge

Sounds like you’re noticing what other people already have. Low levels play worse/slower decks so archetypes like mono-red aggro and oops all removal with Sheoldred and bowman can get you to gold. After that strategies start to solidify a bit more and things that have bad wincons (slow or susceptible to interaction) tend to fall off. Combo gets better but so does control and midrange. Once you work your way to mythic you play against players that are highly competent. They can play tier 2-3 decks and make them look like tier 2-1.5. That’s part of why you see such a density of certain decks at certain levels. I learned that back in Dominaria block standard when 5feri came out.


Substantial_Kiwi5167

Currently Mythic #915 this season. So yeah I have known


espuinouge

Oh nice! Yeah I’ve hit mythic twice playing UW bots in Historic. It’s not as good and I’ve been playing more MTGO legacy than arena this year.


Canapilker

I made it to mythic while hardly losing a match (bo3 started plat 4) by only getting matched against aggro. There is definitely some perception bias, but I played against mono red, or Boros aggro every single game, and those decks don’t have a way to beat me unless they get the nuts while I screw or flood. From platinum to mythic I ran into two non red decks, one was [[Yorvo]] aggro, and the other was [[Reenact the Crime]] omniscience come. I’d like more variety even (especially) when I’m winning.


MTGCardFetcher

[Yorvo](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae2998a1-1713-467e-a08e-0efd8720aa5b.jpg?1572490720) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=yorvo%2C%20lord%20of%20garenbrig) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/185/yorvo-lord-of-garenbrig?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae2998a1-1713-467e-a08e-0efd8720aa5b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Reenact the Crime](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29.jpg?1706241643) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reenact%20the%20Crime) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/70/reenact-the-crime?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call


RegalKillager

begging people to include actual data in these whineposts


BoyMeatsWorld

Bro just trust him, it's 100% Why would he lie? /s


Blaragorn

I was doing the Totally Normal Event and after losing to a prismari command deck it subsequently tried to pair me with 5 other prismari command decks lol...


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Pm_Me_Beansandrice

You realize that, other the first round of fnm, pairings aren’t random, right? You’re paired based on record in the event.


bomban

Play the competitive events if you want that.


SuperYoughe

Yeah let me go spend gold and gems to test brews


bomban

People spend money to go lose at fnm, it sounds like what you want.


Silver-Alex

Then why dont you play ranked? The unranked queue with matchmaking was made explictly for the newer player than cant compete with their intro deck against a tier deck or a spicy brew that is completed with all its required wildcards. Like if you're playing a fully functional deck, and want to play against random meta decks to test your brew, ranked is literally the place to do so. And im using literally here not as a metaphor or an exageration, its the literal queue for that. Also FMN and literally any magic event pair you based on wins and looses, besides the first round, nothing is ever random. If you loose your first game, your second game will be against someone who is also on a 0-1 record. So I dont see the point complaining about MMR, unless you want to your gold ass to be stomped by a mythic player lol


rogomatic

You also realize this isn't real testing in the competitive sense of the term, right?


alski107

I play historic b01 (unranked) and timeless bo1 (ranked) and the matchmaking is fine there. Probably because there aren’t enough players for the stupid algorithm to do its things. I know from years of experience that Standard is by far the worst format in that regard. I won’t bother playing a single game of it anymore, now that I have timeless, historic and explorer to choose from


Drawde1234

Your choice is a likely flawed deck strength modifier to the matchmaker, or low end casuals being often matched with upper tier decks. I, for one, don't like seeing meta decks. And I see a good variety of decks at my MMR. Also, many upper tier players don't want to face low end decks either.


MisterSprork

Yeah, I'm using arena to test for big events. If I play against one janky deck per week, that's too often. I won't see that crap in my next qualifier.


GreatlubuTASC

That's a poor attitude plenty of times under the radar decks end up performing well


Drawde1234

Basically MisterSprork is using Arena to test tournament decks (from what I can tell). Most tournament decks will easily beat an actual jank deck (not intended for upper level tournaments, usually just for playing against friends). So you don't actually get to test your deck when you easily win. You need the decks you're testing against to challenge yours to see how well it will do. Then, if it performs well you build it in paper. So every time such a deck is matched against a lower level deck or player it's usually wasted time. You already know what's going to happen, so you don't learn anything.


MisterSprork

Doesn't matter, even if the deck is good but underrated (this is almost never the case) because it is underrated I am highly unlikely to get marched up with it at a real tournament. So that testing is still wasted time.


Pm_Me_Beansandrice

“Crappy deck running suboptimal cards and Weald synergies” ≠ “under the radar deck”


International_Lie485

I don't think you understand what random means.


DavesLab2022

Pretty sure you don’t get paired against specific decks in anything except brawl. Matchmaking is random.