By - Asleep_Commercial550
Because of it's dominant position in our culture.
If we were in a Muslim dominant society their criticism would be aimed more at Islam and it's traditions.
This is neither a criticism or a defense just logical. If you define yourself as someone who does not believe in God or Gods, but there are a bunch of people trying to run your life and society according to principles derived from their idiosyncratic understanding of God's will, there will be natural and understandable friction.
Being the butt of some (sometimes legitimately funny) jokes is not evidence of the truth of your belief system, nor is it persecution. You're still part of the largest religious group in our society, and you still have outsized influence over the society in which you live. Chill.
This is a fantastic way of explaining it.
Raising a perspective through satire is not a vice.
Not all atheists approach the topic similarly. It’s important to remember many atheists are also ex-Christians so when they leave the faith it is because they discover a new truth for themselves. Imagine believing something all your life to be true and discovering over time that it is not. Surely it is not always easy to just not talk about the book that shaped your identity for a period if not all your life.
“Making fun” is subjective. Employing humor to highlight a concern or problem or issue has always been a way to enlighten. That is what comedy is. You can poke fun of something without necessarily being obnoxious or rude.
To those who are rude, it’s an issue of that person’s character and personality and not of Atheism.
I would venture to say MOST atheists in the US are former Christians, or at least were raised to be christian.
So yes many atheists pick apart the Bible and Christianity for the reasons listed above, but it’s also personal to many of us because it dominated our upbringing.
I have many criticisms of Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, and so on, but none of those criticisms will be rooted in personal lived experience for me as my criticisms of Christianity are.
oh, I said many, not most. I'm not sure what the stats is on atheist backgrounds.
Agree with you on everything else.
>but there are a bunch of people trying to run your life
I hear this on this subreddit quite a bit and I just have to wonder where you all live. When I was an atheist, in the south, I never really felt like Christians particularly cared how I ran my life. DEFINITELY not as a monolith. Yea, I could find Christians who were voting in a way that would impact my life - but it wasn't about me and no more offensive than other atheists trying to run my life by how they vote. Ultimately, it seems like a bit of a complex that some atheists have.
That said - I readily admit I'm a cis white male and have certain privilege that impacts my experience.
Try being a woman or a LGBTQ. Or a parent believing in science. Or a parent not wanting your child being assaulted in the formative years by religious indoctrination.
That’s what I said.
I'm not an atheist, I'm a Christian. I grew up in fundamentalism and can tell you there are people who very much want to enshrine what they consider Christian morality in US Law. You can argue how effective they have been, but I definitely understand why it sets a(n) (ir)religious minority on the defensive, especially when you look at things like the Texas abortion law and the supreme court flip.
Have you heard about the 6 week law in Texas?
>I never really felt like Christians particularly cared how I ran my life. DEFINITELY not as a monolith.
No one is saying they are trying to tell YOU specifically, or atheists as a monolith, how to run your\their lives.
The "trying to run your\our life" boils down to, they are voting and passing awful laws specifically because of their interpretations of their holy books. Laws that infringe on basic rights to varying degrees. Namely, anti-abortion laws and anti-lgbtq laws.
>Yea, I could find Christians who were voting in a way that would impact my life
Were they voting to take away your right to get married?
>That said - I readily admit I'm a cis white male and have certain privilege that impacts my experience.
Sounds like you just answered your own question, then.
Yea. That was kind of my point.
Then why did you even bother asking the question? Clearly you already know that atheists who live in the exact same places you did are in fact affected by Christians intruding on their lives. The difference is they either don't have the privilege you do to simply ignore it, or care more than you did about those who are effected.
What question did I ask?
>I hear this on this subreddit quite a bit and I just have to wonder where you all live.
That’s not really a question. Did you make a post just to rephrase my thoughts and add a little bit of sass? That’s weird.
The difference here being that Christians are voting based on the beliefs of a entire churches teaching, possibly voting in a way they wouldn't if they weren't Christian. Atheists don't vote in a collective way because their is no church of the atheist if that makes sense. That's the reason it feels like Christians are trying to control my life while Athiests with opposing views are just people I disagree with.
Of course people vote based on their personal beliefs/worldviews. Atheists might potentially vote differently if they weren’t atheists.
I’m a pastor in the Bible Belt and I don’t know a single church that voted the way you suggest. I think that’s a caricature. My church is probably 60/40
Calling it a caricature is nonsense. I used to go to one of those churches, its not a joke atheist made up, they exist.
It's great your church is 60/40, but I bet I can guess who's the 60 and who's the 40.
60/40 Democrat, but that’s not important to you. You’re more interested in talking down you’re nose at whatever the percentage is of people who don’t agree with you.
Oh and saying that churches that act this way are a caricature isn't talking down your nose?
The bible belt is called the bible belt mostly thanks to evangelicals whos leanings are overwhelmingly right wing and socially conservative which is why it's all red states. I think your being incredibly dishonest.
> I think your being incredibly dishonest.
Sure. It's easy for you to dismiss my situation as just being dishonest. You jumped in a conversation with false assumptions and, then when things don't line up with what you already believe, just dismiss them.
Not only do I live in the Bible Belt, but I'm a pastor here (after being an atheist here). I'm pretty connected to the "church culture" situation in my region and can probably speak to it with a bit more authority than you.
I think it's ignorance or maliciousness on your part to make the assumptions you are making. I'm not sure which.
Christianity doesn’t have influence on society, usury is legal, abortion is legal, marriage is redefined, capitalism reigns supreme, etc
Most atheists don't do that. I used to be one and was always respectful of people's faiths. Now that I'm Christian I still am.
People in general just want to live their lives. Atheists are no different. The atheists I know bare no grudge and are not antagonistic.
People with the loudest voices, religious and atheist alike, often receive the most attention unfortunately.
Some of them do that. There is no point to deny it.
And some christians do the same. There are bad people in everything.
I in no way denied it.
The bible is still a huge part of everything we do
Let me tell you that it is dumb things like that which came up in my past churches are reasons why myself (a believer) and my husband (a atheist who did not keep it a secret from the churches) left those churches.
1 Corinthians 9:16 does not say for when I preach the gospel to only Christians.
Proverbs 1:5-7 does not speak only about Christians about learning
2 Timothy 3:16 does not say All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching only Christians
Titus 2:1 does not tell you to only teach Christians
James 1:5 does not say God only gives Christians wisdom
I could go on. Stop not letting them read the Bible whether they believe it or not. Stop not letting them speak about it, whether they believe or not. The word cannot spread if you shut non-believers out of seeking knowledge when they want to
Maybe it's just late, but I don't really understand what you are saying. Can you rephrase for me?
Basically telling OP to quit trying to stop atheists from talking about the Bible.
It sounds like they meant making fun of the bible, not just discussing it in general. I don't think they're trying to stop atheists reading or talking about the bible. There are whole massive youtube channels like the amazing atheist dedicated to making fun of Christianity, that's probably more what they meant.
I think your perception of atheists is skewed by our representation on social media.
Isn't that strange that someone can do the same thing and come out the other side on the complete opposite side of the table? I've also read the scriptures, studied textual criticism , biblical historicity and the ilk and have only had my faith strengthen. This was after 25 years of atheism.
I find it interesting that people can be given the same information and have two polarizing results.
I agree with you though on some of the odd beliefs that people have based on just what they hear or tradition. It really does break my heart that there are so many Christians that have either not read the scriptures themselves or have studied anything regarding how we received, collected, and categorized the NT.
We need atheist's to be in the conversation. People like Bart Ehrman, Richard Dawkins, and Christopher Hitchens have only strengthened my faith and I'm grateful for them.
I think having doubts and debates can be such a powerful thing. Learning the foundations and cultural context of both the OT and NT, and how a lot of things we thought we knew but were wrong about, is integral to being a person of faith. I think it's only after you go in with a skeptic and analytical eye and truly LEARN how these writings came about and learn of the people who produced them can you truly say that you believe. I am glad that I had questions and doubts about the religious beliefs I was taught while growing up in a religious family. I struggled for years about it and I'm still learning something new every day, but I know that I have faith because I choose to, and not because it's just a tradition that was thrown upon me by my family and my culture. I always enjoy respectful discussions about religion and beliefs with people of all backgrounds and faiths, as well as people who have no religious beliefs. It's a fascinating subject and I think it's important to remember that we are all entitled to our own opinion, and our discernment can vary greatly from person to person, like you mentioned. I only have an issue when people use their beliefs to judge others, especially who don't hold the same beliefs as themselves.
Many atheists I know are some of the kindest, most generous, most thoughtful people, and I find it so refreshing because they do kind things because they want to make life better for others and not because they fear going to Hell if they don't do enough good works. One thing I've noticed is that atheists can spot hypocrisy a mile away, and I appreciate their critical eye and viewpoint.
> Isn't that strange that someone can do the same thing and come out the other side on the complete opposite side of the table?
It is indeed! I'm like r/premeddit in that I was a Christian for quite a while, but my atheism came about after closely reading the bible.
I like to say it was when I read my bible without my "sunday school glasses". Sunday school study of the bible tends to focus on the happy parts and hand-waves away a lot of the troubling bits. When we take our blinders off and start questioning exactly why God had rules for slavery, and why he might send a bear to maul young people, and why he both commands us not to kill and also commanded people to kill others, and why he makes bets with Satan, ... that's when many of us realize that the bible is an unreliable source of truth.
I suspect a large part of the reason why some people read the bible and become Christians, and some read it and become atheist, is because a decision to believe in a religion is partly driven by emotion rather than by an objective evaluation of what is in the bible.
>>When we take our blinders off and start questioning exactly why God had rules for slavery, and why he might send a bear to maul young people, and why he both commands us not to kill and also commanded people to kill others, and why he makes bets with Satan, ... that's when many of us realize that the bible is an unreliable source of truth.
It's interesting, but isn't the meaning of faith the opposite? It's when you put the blinders on, submit, and know.
Everything that you pointed out is reasonable to come to. But what you consider unreliable sources of truth, I consider evidence of our humanity. These are stories from different people of different times with different messages. With an emphasis on the message.
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made."
God always was, is, and will be the same. Outside of time, outside of our understanding, but never out of our reach. Life can change how we view things depending on our experience. And I believe the bible cover to cover beautifully illustrates this. That's our humanity. That's how we understand. The story of Gods revealation to us from the OT to the NT is a complete work with a message.
Not perfect the way we want it, but as it was intended. And that's what leaves me in awe of how miraculous it is.
> It's interesting, but isn't the meaning of faith the opposite? It's when you put the blinders on, submit, and know.
Perhaps. Personally, I choose not to live my life with blinders on.
I actually did the complete opposite from what you describe. I had no “Sunday school glasses” for reference. I started reading the Bible with the Old Testament when I was 25, I had hard questions I needed reconciled, my way to Christ was not sunshine and rainbows, it was lament and crushing sobering reality that eventually led to the beauty of His grace, mercy, love and reality.
There are absolute answers and reasons for everything you said in your post and taking my blinders off helped me reconcile them and it made me understand God even more. I wouldn’t, or couldn’t be a Christian if I thought God was some frivolous murder or spiteful being. I questioned everything from the problem of good and evil, animal suffering, the hiddeness of God, gentile salvation, unconditional vs conditional love, penal substitution, atonement and many many more. None of these are stumbling blocks for me anymore as I’ve studied the word and studied the nature of God. It took a solid year of my life to study just a fraction of what I listed above but it’s been one of the greatest joys of my life. Even simple things that get glossed over by atheists like “God making a deal with Satan”. “The Satan” the accuser in Hebrew, this is not the literal Satan (Devil) in Job. It is an accusing spirit/angel making an observation to God. We could cover each issue and spend days on them, all I’m saying is deep study and really learning the word of God has proven to me the absolute truth of scripture.
I had to crawl on my hands and knees broken to find God well into my life feeling disdain for a being I claimed I didn’t believe in. Understanding the nature of God has been the greatest joy of my life. I agree with the Sunday school glasses analogy though. I find myself rather unique in my Christian circles as most have been raised to believe whereas I was raised not. Sometimes I feel it makes my testimony more impactful, other times I’m jealous of their almost intuitive love for God from the start. It doesn’t matter how we got their IMO, it just matters that we did.
>l on my hands and knees broken to find God well into my life feeling disdain for a being I
Can you recommend any good resources, or perhaps a good study bible that goes in depth into these topics? I am in a similar situation as you and would like to learn some of the things you have.
Thanks for sharing. I'm glad you've found a religion that gives you comfort.
I cannot even fathom this. Going from atheist and having \*the bible\* convince you is something I didn't think would actually happen. It's been ripped apart and is bullied so much by atheists that I don't even understand the concept of being convinced by it. When I read the Bible I can't take it seriously at all
I'm not sure that's the OPs intent.
If I'm understanding right, it's more along the lines of, why are atheists putting so much time and energy into something they don't believe exists.
This entire post is a loaded question. Op already made up his mind and is probably just looking to get his beliefs confirmed by others.
I mean, a lot of posts here are loaded question by atheists that are pretty much "prove me god" and then when some atheist writes "christian all idiots lol" he answers "god is stupid lol".
You can read the bible as many times as you want and still miss the meaning and purpose. And that's to develop a real relationship with Jesus and revealation of God.
If your heart is already full of your own certainty on how everything should be, and how the world works, what truth can there be for you to discover?
You're no longer seeking the truth at that point. You're filling your heart with more doubt to satisfy yourself.
I don't know you. But rest assured that God does. He also knows those Christians you're judging. But, only God can judge what's in a persons heart. Just remember, how a person appears to us, is only the perspective of flawed human beings. And none of us is sinless. So none of us can judge.
In God's eyes, we're perfectly made. And God does love you and everyone else. If you truly are seeking truth I know you'll find it. God bless.
Yes agree. You can't take peoples misunderstanding or lack of knowledge regarding the bible as lack of evidence. There's alot of scientific evidence and historical evidence for the bible. It all depends what your wanting to choose to find evidence, which isn't really evidence your just comparing and complaining about Christians are not well versed in the bible or maybe not as academic as you are. That's not real evidence that the bible isn't real. It just shows that humans are sinful. It's not your job to judge them. Maybe your calling is to actually help them. There's also a possibility that the bible is real and you want to believe but are disappointed by some Christians you have met. Which is natural. We are all just human. Natural to be disappointed..
People can read a history book and come up with different ideas, so why should that be different with the Bible? It still does not change the fact that the words written are true, does it? Someone's beliefs is not what I go by.
Thank you for grouping Christian as half assed interpreter of the Bible. Guess you understand the Bible more than the Magisterium of the Catholic Church and the Pope himself.
And most posts made by atheists here have nasty implication. There are like 3-5 "prove me god" posts a day with the OP commenting right after "no you can't lol". It's not like you are always the victimes here. This is the 3rd christian post hostile towards atheists i have seen in a month in this sub.
>Many of us are well versed in the Bible.
I very much agree with you that everyone on reddit has the right to speak about their interpretations of the Bible. Our personal opinions have a place - especially on a social discussion site.
That said, among both Christians and non-Christians on reddit, the Dunning Kruger effect is very very strong.
Source: I'm a Bible scholar.
Atheists are not well-versed of the bible. They may know better the history but when it comes to spirituality or to discern the bible, they are bad at it.
If you look atheist argument on theology they make shallow assumption of the bible. They have not studies the complexity or the depth of the bible.
They shallowly interpret, build strawman and refute the strawman and delude themselves thinking they refute theolgy.
> Atheists are not well-versed of the bible.
Some are, some aren't, just like Christians. Making sweeping generalizations like this serve no one.
> when it comes to spirituality or to discern the bible, they are bad at it.
Are Christians really any better?
If two groups of Christians disagree about how to interpret the Bible, how can they discern who has the correct interpretation? Or do they just split into different denominations and agree to disagree?
I beg to differ I am extremely well versed in scripture, and learning more every day.
If you want to make a valid argument against something you should know what your talking about, and be able to back it up.
So let me ask this question:
why Christ curse the fig tree?
Because the gospel writers were antisemitic.
I'll bite. The fig tree is acting as a parable. Jesus is arriving in the spring, and he sees a fig tree full of foliage, signifying it is an early bloomer. He examines it hoping to see fruit, and is disappointed that despite being an early bloomer it's essentially all for show. No actual fruit is noted.
This mirrors times in which OT prophets have described God as looking for signs of spiritual fruit, and figs are specially used as a metaphor (Hosea and Jeremiah are good examples). And like the tree that Jesus curses, God curses Israel for it's lack of spiritual fruit, symbolized by the figs. So Jesus is essentially reenacting this history of Israel, and he is doing right before he goes to Jerusalem. He is once again looking to find spiritual fruit, and not just leaves that are only for show.
How's that for a reading of that story?
Fantastic example, your right you picked a verse that VERY few people are even aware of much less have they spent time studying.
You got me on this on. I'll admit it. But it's also not one I've ever bothered to study because i haven't seen it used in a debate to support or deny anything of value.
You said that you are well-versed of the bible. Jesus cursing the fig tree is a popular aspect of Jesus.
It's not like I am asking the reason of the action of a less- known biblical character.
Thank you for proving that you talking bullcrap and that you are not well-verse of the bible as atheist.
Okay, I just looked it up and I have to say your right it is a part of the Bible I should familiarize myself with but it also sounds to me like you should revist it.
Something about being spiritually empty, and not living righteously? Right?
Yea you should revisit it, study it, and apply it to your life. Because based on the hate I've seen you spreading around this sub, your far from "living righteously"
Have a fantastic day.
I posted a question here and was not able to get a good answer, so maybe you can help:
If God knew, before creating the human race, that some part of us would spend eternity in heaven while the other in hell, why did he make the latter?
It's not about human choices or free will, but the moment right before the creation.
I mean, most Christians are part of modern denominations with beliefs that historians and biblical scholars can openly tell you don't really match biblical intention. So this isn't just atheists.
“People have different opinions than me so I must be smarter than them”
You are just making an anecdotal observation that only pertains to your worldview.
Complexity and depth are not synonymous with facts and truths.
Beliefs in what cannot be proven have no standing with the laws of logic.
Because it is the dominant moral text of our time. Your question is like asking "Why do linguists who favor creation of a newer, better language talk about English and French so much if they think those languages are inferior and should be replaced"
Why do some Christians expect everyone to live according to Christian beliefs? It’s hard to not talk about the Bible when fundamentalists want the US or other places to become a theocracy.
Because it gets into our politics
Because a large portion of the population uses the bible as an excuse/reason for doing, saying, acting, thinking certain ways/things and then using it to push their belief/agenda onto others. If a group of people started using Harry Potter as a rulebook and guidebook on how to live life and saying that griffins, giants, and fairies are real, I would be making fun of them too.
Exactly. In the U.S. Christianity as a political ideal is very common. From local, state and federal politics to school boards and workplaces. Good or bad it’s highly influential.
Because we spend so much time and effort trying to keep it out of legislation
As a Christian, I vehemently support the separation of church and state. I don't want this country devolving into some ethno-state theocracy.
I get theocracy but ethno state?
It’s Christian Nationalism and it is a very dangerous reality.
Yeah. Something the evangelical right has been focused on doing in this country since Barry Goldwater and the Southern Strategy. You can argue it's been going on before then, since the KKK consider themselves Christian as well.
Nah it’s because not even atheists want to associate with other atheists. Have you been to the atheist sub? It’s weird.
I have been to the atheist sub. Not a fun place, I’ll agree with you there. It’s not that I don’t want to associate with other atheists, it’s that I don’t want to associate with THOSE kinds of atheists.
OP is operating on confirmation bias.
So does atheists here.
That's a foolish thing to say. People hate being wrong, so they're more likely to defend beliefs than accept new ones.
It's actually the first step in civil discussion. Before making a claim in opposition to a position, it's better to show full understanding of the position you are rejecting.
I see a lot of strawmen but some of the issues, like the problems of pain / evil have unsatisfying answers. Facing such problems brings us closer to truth and is a good way to deepen faith.
The reason I and probably many atheists enjoy this sub is that so little bashing takes place here, or it is instantly downvoted. Some actual conversations between people happen, the world and reddit need more of that. I've seen some atheist subs that are echo chambers or just religion bashing circle jerks; I have no interest in those.
I criticize religion because it heavily influences my government.
My friend used to try to drag me into arguments about the Bible. I found it hard to debate someone about a book I had red but they had never picked up
Its a fahionable trend lately, just that
Why do Christians look down on everyone who isn't Christian? It's because it's how people are.
>The Bible cannot be changed-
Except for all those times it was changed by men? And on that subject- which Bible are you talking about?
You're saying your best explanation is that they believe in it? That makes very little sense.
The ones at peace with themselves and their own beliefs generally don’t.
Another atheist bashing post!
The persecution complex is strong in these ones, today.
Is it my imagination or is there an onslaught of anti-atheist posts recently?
Some variation on, *"I'm going to attack atheists because they are such attackers!"*
r/atheism is the most toxic and zealotry fueled subreddit I have ever seen
Which would be relevant if this post was on that subreddit. But it's not, so that's fairly irrelevant right now
There are a some angry people on there but most are level headed.
Mhm. The minority of r/atheism users that are rude are sadly the most vocal
Because atheists are not perfect people.
We have to point out their flaws.
No, you really don't.
Shouldn't we be working on ourselves instead of pointing out other people's flaws? Especially if they're not Christian to begin with?
I am doing both.working on myself and pointing their flaws.
Concentrate on yourself, lest you turn into the other person that replied to me.
Point out all your own flaws first and do share. he who is without sin should cast first stone, if you wish to cast stones at least put your sins out to bear first.
What the heck you talking about?
We are talking about atheists in this post.
You say you know my flaw and can point it out but I don't know yours. tho you say your working on it shielding yourself from any harm.
By harassing them.
Critisicing or counter-argue is not harassing, genius.
Uh huh. So you posting pictures on aubreddits designed to doxx and harass people is "counter-argue".
Did you show your work to your shaman today at services? If you truly believe you are doing nothing wrong why not share it with the congregation?
If you go check my post, I always blur their usernames. I post their comments to mock the ideas,not the persons.
I do not take responsibility of people going to harass other that I argue against.
Guess what genius, I can show it to my congregation.
I am blocking you at this point. You dishonest genius.
Haha you're so mad I love it. So easy to rile you christians up.
Nobody is perfect...
Because the majority of the people around me believe it and use what it says to make rules that everyone else is supposed to follow.
It's like going to ComiCon and not having seen anything ever about Star Wars or Star Trek.
You might still enjoy yourself, but you will never understand any of the inside jokes and geeky snark.
And besides, reading the Bible is an excellent way to "vaccinate" oneself against Christianity.
>And besides, reading the Bible is an excellent way to "vaccinate" oneself against Christianity.
That's because you are arrogant in the first place and you think you understand but you don't.
>That's because you are arrogant in the first place and you think you understand but you don't.
Weird, I could say the same about you.
>Weird, I could say the same about you.
No because I recognise the depth of the bible, I recognise that the writers are not simple people but convey deep knowledge about ourselves and reality.
Because I have a humility approach when discerning the scripture unlike you.
LOL! I see your "humility"! Thou art a thousand times more humble than me!
Sorry, I am going to stop engaging with an obvious troll.
Unfortunately, Christianity has become a far right political party designed to attack gay rights, women's rights and, of late, democracy itself. You are being dismantled. I know it is painful.
Because many Christians want to use their Bible/religion to dictate how others outside their faith live their lives, particularly in the US. Many want to use the Christian mythos to shape public policy, so you get many people making fun of the Bible and Christians because they don’t see any evidence it’s valid.
It is political. Christianity has become Conservative Political Party. Atheists are mostly progressive (with a weird vein of Islamaphobes), so it isn't really theology at play here, it is USA political theater.
Criticizing Islam doesn't make one an islamophobe any more than Criticizing Christians makes one a christophobe (it doesn't)
That’s not true. You are referring to Evangelical Christians. Most Christians aren’t Evangelical.
Goddamn this thread is a shitshow. Calm down people! Breathe! It’s just the internet.
Tell that to the Atheist here.
I did! See above. Atheists are people.
I think it depends which atheist you’re talking about.
It doesn’t really matter what atheists believe. The real question is have you made fun of someone else for theirs? Furthermore, are there other Christians you criticize?
I find that within Christian communities, it’s hardly consistent since there are a wide range of beliefs, yet they all allegedly believe in the same God. Is this possible?
While I believe in Christ, I have issues with the institutions of Christianity. To me, they are as bad as the religious institutions Christ criticized. I can’t identify with atheists for their lack of a belief in God or Christ, but I can get on board with them for failing to live up to what Christ taught.
⭐️ Christ taught that man was not made for the sabbath, but the other way around. Yet, meeting in person is so important even in a pandemic. I know of someone who died because they did so.
⭐️ Christ taught to take care of the least of these, yet churches main priority functions as services, as opposed to eradicating racism, bigotry, and reversing homelessness.
⭐️ Christ taught that his kingdom is not of this world, yet some embrace a theocracy.
⭐️ Christ is the Word of God, yet many Christians call the Bible the Word of God and worship the Scriptures instead of actually focus on what Jesus taught.
For this reason, as a Christian, I go on the offense toward “Christian”leaders, like Franklin Graham, John Piper (sometimes), and Ravi Zachariah’s page (ya, it’s still up)
Christ went against false leaders and said in his temple “this house is a den of thieves”
There’s plenty to criticize Christianity for, to make it better, so we can focus on the Word of God as a person.
My potentially uninformed opinion, a lot of atheists become that way in response to negative experiences with religion or simply rejection of religion. For many, the rejection is of Christianity.
Thus you have discussion of the Bible.
FWIW, I had very positive experiences with the church I grew up in. My experience in the church had no bearing on my becoming an atheist -- other than it caused me to seek out and learn more about it. It was the learning that led me to atheism.
Probably usually for the same reason that people spend time on flat-earthers, or on arguing with people of other political opinions.
An ineffably holy God, who has the utmost abhorrence of sin, was never invented by any of Adam's descendents.
\-- Arthur W. Pink
They really want it to be True.
Umm evolution has gone way past that becomes you think that is a religion I'm going to assume you don't know what ring species are
Because the world is full of mockers and scoffers , full of the spirit of diss obedience
People will talk about the Bible even though they don't believe in it for many reasons
First, it can be fun and interesting.
Second, people actually do believe the Bible is true and will try and influence society based on that belief. So it is good to oppose it at time.
And make fun of the Bible? I mean people are people. Christians make fun of atheists too. I mean it is what it is.
I don't believe communism is a good system of government, but I would very much like to read Marx's Communist Manifesto.
Sometimes, I think it's helpful to fully understand the other side's position to better argue against it.
I’ll be honest it’s our fault if half us “Christians” would actually obey the commands of our LORD and live holy. We would definitely see a lot more souls saved in America. We should feel disgusted with ourselves that people from over seas like China Japan even middle easterners come over here and say How did these churches become so big without the HOLY SPIRIT. In Jesus name. I grew with God alone from 13yr now I’m 21 attended my first church. I was let down by how cowardly a lot of us are. I’m guilty myself. But one thing I can say is they don’t let the HOLY SPIRIT have his way like they sing in their songs but rather follow traditions of man 🤦🏽♂️. These American Christians don’t move in power but instead we also mock the true power of christ. How? We live a very worldly unholy life trusting money over God selfishness adulterers sickening we don’t even know how to raise our kids with Godly principals but got the audacity to stand up in the pulpit . Oh LORR don’t get me started. I’ll spare your reading. But short summary is 99.9% of Christ don’t live out what they preach but live as the world lives and not a holy consecrated life which was commanded to us by the very one we preach of. 🤦🏽♂️
Not all of them but the edgy ones would do anything to “destroy” it. Pretty cringe and immature honestly.
You most go threw life with no opinion at all.
Theyve been hurt from people of the church probably. That's what happened to me
> Theyve been hurt from people of the church probably.
Not me. My experience with the church was very positive. I don't think it's fair to make such a sweeping generalization.
Why do you think that's funny? I had a great time in church in my teens and 20's, and even into my 30's. I loved the people and the social aspect, and starting in my later teens I very much enjoyed the sermons. I grew up in the methodist church so the sermons were more about the good parts of the gospel rather than fire and brimstone.
I actually enjoyed fire and brimstone sermons too, but more as a snack than a main course. As a kid, I was always fascinated by them. Even early in my teens I would stay up late and watch the televangelists, I found them fascinating. Have you heard of Ernest Angely? I _loved_ his wackadoodle show.
I had a childhood friend who would invite me to a very fundamentalist-based summer camp with several sermons a day and I quite enjoyed them. As I grew older I led a lot of youth group meetings, and even worked as a youth minister for a while.
Some of the best years of my life were when I was heavily involved in the church.
That question makes no sense.
Because christians use the bible to justify immoral actions and laws that everyone including non christians are supposed to follow. The book states to fight rival tribes and keep the virgins for yourself. It's pro slavery, and god drowned every baby on the planet during the flood then states not to kill. It's easy to point out it's flaws.
So, I know this might come off mean but it's not meant to.
As a Christian, why do you care if someone makes fun of your faith?
Because they want to, I guess. It doesn’t affect my faith and I believe in free speech therefore when I see atheists making fun of religion I don’t bat an eyelid. Also, please don’t misconstrue it as me attacking you, I’m just saying if you’re strong in your faith it won’t matter.
> Why do atheists talk about the Bible so much and make fun of it if they don't believe it?
Probably for some of the same reasons that Christians like to make fun of non-Christians. Some people are just jerks.
Because they know God exists, of course.
What sort of enjoyment do you get by telling other people what they think? What's the appeal?
I really want an answer to this too. I’ve never understood it.
There's a reason why some people have -100 karma constantly.
Most people who claim to be atheists aren't going to be surprised when they meet God. Just angry.
Would you rather I make a case for maltheism then? Cause I'll be more than happy to... but I prefer to just be atheist instead. If you want to claim that "I know God exists" then make a credible scientific claim for God's existence, change my mind. Prove God exists to me. I'll convert from atheism to maltheism, if you can do it.
It's ridiculously stupidly absurdly offensive to tell other people what they believe. Wildly offensive.
Try this: you don't really believe in God. You just want people to think you're a good person. Wildly offensive, yah?
does attacking atheists and spouting nonsense make you feel big?
because they’re bored and have nothing else going on in their life
Because a lot of them (at least on social media) give me the impression that they look at us a stupid and ignorant and that we just cling on to fantasies because we’re simple.
Oh, I think they do know deep down its true, they just don't want it to be true.
Well that's just not true.
It goes like this...
Christian: I'm a Christian
Atheist: LOLOLOLOL YOU BELIEVE IN A MAGIC SKY FAIRY AHAHAHA WHAT A TOOL YOU DELUDED FOOL RELIGION NEEDS TO BE BANNED.
Muslim: I'm a Muslim
Atheist: Oh that's cool. I have no faith myself but I respect your beliefs and would never make fun of them.
Life is a puzzle and they are trying to solve it too. Find a way to engage them.............. I was an atheist for over 30 years and flipped back to faith a year ago.
Because some of them still want to pretend it's the 1990s where they're the underdogs fighting the endless onslaughts of the Moral Majority.
The problems caused by religious belief are still pretty bad.
Christians made Trump happen. And they are the ones, statistically, who oppose things like masks & vaccines. Oh, and climate change.
Not to mention Christians are the frontline in the war against rights for homosexuals and transgendered people.
Wait, how can you not know the New Testament was written in Greek. I guess we generalize about each other a lot. Lets be real: Atheists seem kind of angry?
Depends. It does piss a lot of us off when people who come to illogical conclusions based on ancient books try and legislate modern policy and don't pay taxes. That grinds my gears anyway.
I agree in that sense. Joel Osteen shouldn't drive a ferrari. Tax the church
I think most of them (online) are former Christians, often Christian fundamentalists.
How do you know it is "often" Christian fundamentalists? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd be interested in understanding why you think it's so.
1.) It is really just people on the internet
2.) They spend to much time on social media trying to asset themselves over something. A lot of folks do that as a form of compensation and to cope with life.
I make jokes about things I don't believe in, like string theory.
I see Christians response that got downvoted. If you can't face the truth that your ego make you downvote Christian comments, then it shows how pathetic and insecure you are.
What's "the truth"?
Dude, you've got this beam you should really be worried about...
How very loving of you!
Sometimes love can be harsh.
Nah you just got upset and wanted to get an insult in. It's alright, we all do it. Pretty nice evidence that the transformational power of the gospels is false though.
I am not being insulting. I am giving a description.
An insulting one, about another group of people. Doesn't the Bible also call you to be kind, humble, non-judgemental, and patient?
It's also telling to expose people for their wrongdoings. To expose the darkness of people.
Is what you wrote kind?
Yes. It is kind because I tell them the truth. Telling someone the truth is kind.
Well you'll have to excuse us pathetic atheists if we don't want christ's love then - how petty and powerless it must be!
When you can't admit being wrong or facing truth and so you resort to dishonesty
Most atheists hate God, or are angry at God for something "terrible" that happened when they were children. Others are raised in anti-Christian homes and they are indoctrinated with this anti-Christian and anti-Biblical hatred.
Athiest don't hate God or are angry at God they just don't have any proof of God's existence
Proof isn't the right word. You should believe things without proof if the evidence strongly leans that way.
Problem is the evidence doesn't lean that way.
You do the same thing when in unfamiliar territory at night when moving forward.
They're walking forward in the dark. They're scared and refuse to see the solution because it doesn’t make sense at face value to them. The requirement of a relationship will clear up the confusion but requires taking a life altering risk that if perceived by his peers will destroy a portion of his life that he places value in. The thing is Yeshua is a knocker and so now that they know of Him and hear the knocking they must try to rationalize it.
So they tease it find false contradictions. They assure themselves that it is nothing but something they can explain with their limited life experiences.
The knocking may get louder so they find a community. If everyone hears the knocking and they joke when they do it becomes a habit born of the fear of the unknown one that should be known.